Tax assessors, trespassing and leering into windows...

[Henry]

Okay, first and foremost allow me to attempt to bring some understanding to the situation as to the reasons local township or county assessors would be visiting your property for assessment purposes. I used to work for the county assessor in the county I grew up in until last September. I know work for a private contractor who works with local county/township government (assessor's offices) providing them valuation services in their appeal processes (when disagreement over what is fair market value of a property is filed by a taxpayer or tax rep on their behalf). With both my past employment and my current I am familiar with assessing offices and the things they have to do in order to hopefully capture proper valuations on properties.

I will stress I work with quite possibly two of the most well ran and professional acting offices, which strive and many times go above and beyond what they have to do in service to their local tax payers and land owners. However, I know first hand not all offices have knowledgeable or fully capable people and practices/actions show this lack of ability.

As for why a local assessing employee would be visiting your property:

-Permit taken out for new structure or sufficient updates requiring a data change that would justify an increase or decrease in assessed value (demo). Many areas the building departments work hand in hand with the Assessors to make the process as efficient and uniform across the tax base as much as possible. In an effort to make no assumptions to sizes, quality of construction or other things many offices will do a field visit instead of "if their office has it" using GIS imagery for measurements.

-New sale of the property. A new sale requires the office to verify the data on the Property Record Card to make sure nothing has changed either in a positive value influence or a negative. This is needed because of the vast amount of changes or updates or demos which can go unlogged with a permit or unreported to the assessing office.

-Request by taxpayer...pretty self explanatory.

-Reassessment. This is the most common one especially with the General Assembly passing that now counties/townships in our state must do a cyclical reassessment (re-analysis) of ALL parcels in a 4 year period in their jurisdiction (25% one year, 25% another year and so on). This is to ensure discrepencies can be caught and the data is as accurate as possible. In order to properly assess a property whether an assessor or an appraisor you must have accurate data. The default cost approach the states use which is than trended relies on this data even more so. This is most likely the case the OP is dealing with....while many counties (I know Elkhart does) send out notices of visits upcoming to the most recent mailing address on record with the county, they technically don't have to atleast I don't think so, but it is encouraged. If the land is posted/gated or blocked off by any means they cannot go around this to my understanding, nor can the require entry into any structure...that will greatly limit the amount of drawn assumptions but it cannot be forced. As for notifying taxpayers some assessors do the mailers like I've stated, but nearly all run a notice in the local papers notifying taxpayers of the visits.

Trust me, most of these field people are just common everyday people (AND YES THEY PAY THE SAME TAXES) just attempting to do their jobs as instructed and then go home each day. Your daughters handled it exactly as they should have, and I know others and myself when I did field work didn't like it when children would answer the door...made me feel uneasy for their sake and would just tell them to close the door and get their parents if their home.

If you own a home or a business and dislike your assessment you have the right to file an appeal within the proper time frames, IT IS YOUR RIGHT! My business can even assist you in this and even represent you if needed, but we cannot take contracts currently in Elkhart or Porter county as we currently assist both in chasing fair market value to their taxpayers that file appeals.

I saw the caps mentioned...and the assumptions assessors are just hiking assessments to make up for them. This SHOULDN'T BE HAPPENING if it is. Indiana is a market value state which means if your assessment can be proven with market evidence to be overstated it is justified that a reduction be sought and done by the county (happens a lot). Just know if you do appeal your assessment it does open the window for the assessment to increase...while many of the assessors I've worked with refuse to "punish" taxpayers in atleast the year under appeal MANY do if it is justified.

Do your most well ran and professional acting offices make appointments with private property owners prior to stepping foot on their private property? Is that their policy?

 

[Tynimiller]

Do your most well ran and professional acting offices make appointments with private property owners prior to stepping foot on their private property? Is that their policy?

Verifications that involve measuring often times there is notices or a call...but like the OP posted it is not necessary given state statutes. I am not saying I defend the statutes or agree with them tho. Similar to Conservation Officers if acting within their rights they can go wherever as well...but still have restrictions. An assessor or assessing employee like described cannot breach an entry, bypass locked gates or such and demand entry.

 

[Henry]

So no.

 

[eldirector]

I believe the is the relevant IC:
Indiana General Assembly, 2015 Session

IC 6-1.1-4-15Appraisal; examination of buildings
Sec. 15. (a) If real property is subject to assessment or
reassessment under this chapter, the assessor of the township in
which the property is located, or the county assessor if there is no
township assessor for the township, shall either appraise the property
or have it appraised.
(b) In order to determine the assessed value of buildings and other
improvements, the township or county assessor or the assessor's
authorized representative may, after first making known the
assessor's or representative's intention to the owner or occupant,
enter and fully examine all buildings and structures which are located
within the township or county and which are subject to assessment.
(Formerly: Acts 1975, P.L.47, SEC.1.) As amended by P.L.24-1986,
SEC.7; P.L.146-2008, SEC.69.

 

[HoughMade]

I believe the is the relevant IC:
Indiana General Assembly, 2015 Session

Where does it say that walking up to the door and asking to come in....before coming in, is not adequate notice?

 

[eldirector]

Where does it say that walking up to the door and asking to come in....before coming in, is not adequate notice?

I don't see the word "adequate" in the IC anywhere.

 

[Tynimiller]

So no.

Obviously you bypassed the first sentence of what I responded with. YES, most times the one office I work with does. I know they do no doubt with reassessment work, both the newspaper and mailings go out.

 

[CathyInBlue]

An assessor or assessing employee like described cannot breach an entry, bypass locked gates or such and demand entry.

Why must the gate be locked? What's at all unclear about a gate that's merely closed and latched? I don't care if there are instructions printed in five languages with annotated diagrams with arrows of how to unlatch and open the gate, if the gate is closed and you're not a welcome guest whose arrival has been prearranged, you do not open a gate, even if it has not been "locked".

Note: Mailmen and meter readers would fall under the "arrival has been prearranged" category. Random government snoops would not.

 

[Tynimiller]

Why must the gate be locked? What's at all unclear about a gate that's merely closed and latched? I don't care if there are instructions printed in five languages with annotated diagrams with arrows of how to unlatch and open the gate, if the gate is closed and you're not a welcome guest whose arrival has been prearranged, you do not open a gate, even if it has not been "locked".

Note: Mailmen and meter readers would fall under the "arrival has been prearranged" category. Random government snoops would not.

Okay perhaps I miss-typed. I don't know of any offices that will open a gate unless owner is home and permission has been granted. Does it happen, possibly but I doubt it very often and if so I bet it is the same field worker doing it.

I get it and like said I don't defend the statutes or practices merely being educational is all....but they are not government snoops. They are merely striving to gain the most accurate data possible so no assumptions have to be made on a property.

 

[HoughMade]

I don't see the word "adequate" in the IC anywhere.

...and your point is?

If I walk up to the door, knock on it, tell the person who answers who I am and what I need to do, how does that NOT comply with the statute.

 

[Tynimiller]

...and your point is?

If I walk up to the door, knock on it, tell the person who answers who I am and what I need to do, how does that NOT comply with the statute.

It does. If asked to leave, guarantee nearly any and all offices have instructed their employees to do so and not be confrontational...ain't worth it. Far too many people view ANY kind of government employee as evil though.

 

[HoughMade]

Well, taxes are​ evil, but they are legal evil.

 

[Tynimiller]

Well, taxes are​ evil, but they are legal evil.

To an extent I agree.

 

[AA&E]

I believe peering into windows sets up the potential for a justifiable ass beating. In the PO's example with a teenage daughter home alone. Let's say OP arrives home to see some man peering into the windows of his home. When he approaches him and looks in the same window, his daughter had just entered that room and started changing her clothes, or walks in wrapped in a towel after showering. How do you think such a scenario plays out from that point on? There is no need for such intrusion, and it certainly should not be sanctioned. If I sat on the jury of such an event like laid out above, the home owner walks free, trial ends in a hung jury, or I am replaced with an alternate.

 

[Henry]

Obviously you bypassed the first sentence of what I responded with. YES, most times the one office I work with does. I know they do no doubt with reassessment work, both the newspaper and mailings go out.

I was going to call and schedule an appointment with my attorney next month.

Instead, I will send him a notice that I will show up between the dates of X and Y.

I'll try the same with my doctor in January.

I suspect they will tell me to make an appointment.


BTW, the OP's daughter should have called 911 when an unknown and unidentified person showed up unannounced in a nondescript vehicle, ignored the posted no trespass signs, and began walking around the property and peering into windows. (Directed at the assessor here, no offense intended to the OP or his family).

This afternoon I installed a lock on the front gate and checked the trip wires.

 

[Henry]

I believe peering into windows sets up the potential for a justifiable ass beating. In the PO's example with a teenage daughter home alone. Let's say OP arrives home to see some man peering into the windows of his home. When he approaches him and looks in the same window, his daughter had just entered that room and started changing her clothes, or walks in wrapped in a towel after showering. How do you think such a scenario plays out from that point on? There is no need for such intrusion, and it certainly should not be sanctioned. If I sat on the jury of such an event like laid out above, the home owner walks free, trial ends in a hung jury, or I am replaced with an alternate.

AMEN!

Jury nullification all the way if I were selected to serve in a trial where the property owner addressed such a person as a threat.

 

[rhino]

Well, taxes are​ evil, but they are legal evil.

Gee, it's a shame that we don't live in a free country where someone could actually own property instead of buying semi-permanent squatting rights and the privilege of perpetually paying rent to the to the government.

Eliminate property taxes and POOF! The issue that spawned this topic is moot.

 

[Tynimiller]

I was going to call and schedule an appointment with my attorney next month.

Instead, I will send him a notice that I will show up between the dates of X and Y.

I'll try the same with my doctor in January.

I suspect they will tell me to make an appointment.


BTW, the OP's daughter should have called 911 when an unknown and unidentified person showed up unannounced in a nondescript vehicle, ignored the posted no trespass signs, and began walking around the property and peering into windows. (Directed at the assessor here, no offense intended to the OP or his family).

This afternoon I installed a lock on the front gate and checked the trip wires.

Again I'm not defending them, but as you state in your various examples I don't believe there is any State Law IC codes that would make it legal for you to do so. Common practice of going to a door and knocking shouldn't be frowned upon, it was their actions after which I feel come into question. I agree the OP's daughter should have and it all would have been resolved without an issue but I would train my kids to do the exact same thing.

 

[Tynimiller]

Gee, it's a shame that we don't live in a free country where someone could actually own property instead of buying semi-permanent squatting rights and the privilege of perpetually paying rent to the to the government.

Eliminate property taxes and POOF! The issue that spawned this topic is moot.

All for that, despite the impact it would have on my revenue...however it cannot be magically removed without repurcussions. Our state isn't ready to handle it, and sadly no plan to recoup all that revenue was stated or feasible without hiking taxes somewhere else.

Field workers for assessor's offices are merely after correct data, as to ensure you're not inaccurately assessed and unfairly treated in comparison to all your fellow taxpayers.

 

[Thor]

Gee, it's a shame that we don't live in a free country where someone could actually own property instead of buying semi-permanent squatting rights and the privilege of perpetually paying rent to the to the government.

Eliminate property taxes and POOF! The issue that spawned this topic is moot.

My spousal unit and I have been advocating this to our state rep...it's going to take a huge swing towards fiscal conservatism and recognition of property rights to make it happen. Our state rep agrees but can only do so much...