Titegroup 9mm problems?

[Leo]

I have loaded many rounds of pistol ammo with titegroup since the late 90's. Much of my loading was .45 acp with cast bullets, which are plenty smoky on their own. I do not like cast in the 9mm. I also observe stains on the outside of my brass in the 9mm and the 40 S&W, even with Plated or jacketed bullets. No discernible smoke from the muzzle, but black stains on the case by the mouth, and I load closer to the top of the range than the bottom. I generally always have a chrono handy and the velocity is right where the load would anticipate. I think that is just a characteristic of that powder. The performance and accuracy is fine.

Maybe it has to do with the higher flash temperature, maybe something else. I would not worry, that staining does not hurt anything. The cleanest burning powders were from VitaVouri. Of course at double the price and spotty availability I just stuck with Titegroup and threw the brass in the tumbler.

 

[Thegeek]

I'm loading titegroup for two loads:

Caliber	Powder	Charge	Projectile	Primer	COL	Notes
9mm	Hogdon Titegroup	4.3	Remington 115g FMJ	CCI 500	1.125	A little hot
9mm subsonic	Titegroup	3	ACME "lipstick" 145.	CCI 500	1.2	Too light, incomplete cycle. Going to 3.2gr

I don't have a chrono, but on the 115gr rounds, you can faintly see the striker hole in the primer. Very consistent and fires well.

The 9mm subbies, I've only shot one batch. If your wrist isn't like steel, it'll short stroke. These rounds are loaded with RNL numbers. Waiting for a chance to test out the 3.2s

 

[bobjones223]

I run 124s with 4.0gr and am getting 1,080 fps with the extreme plated at 1.15". Yes I get some sooting of the brass but if shoots well. Also I know if I take it down to the 1.12" mark the velocity goes up and the sooting goes down but they shoot and feed great they way they are so I didn't see any reason to change?

 

[ru44mag]

I'm glad I read this thread. I recently purchased some Titegroup and was planning to start at 3.5 gr. behind 124 gr. lead cast. Anyone see any problems? The book says 3.3 min and 3.7 max. At 3.5 it should be around 1050 fps. According to the book.

 

[dooshie]

A lot of my pistol loads will be smokey when trying to load lighter, especially with titegroup. If it cycles the pistol, I don't really care. I suppose you get more fouling, but meh??? Also, I have found that my plated loads did best between the cast lead data and the jacketed data.

try a slight crimp to stop the smokey

 

[rvb]

try a slight crimp to stop the smokey

"Crimp" should only be used to remove belling, not actually to bite into the bullet, ESPECIALLY with a plated bullet. Not the right way to add pressure in this situation, Imo.

-rvb

 

[rvb]

9mm subbies, I've only shot one batch. If your wrist isn't like steel, it'll short stroke. These rounds are loaded with RNL numbers. Waiting for a chance to test out the 3.2s

You dnt need to try to load the 145s light. They'll be subsonic regardless. I'm not familiar with that bullet, but 1.2 sounds aweful long. I've loaded around 100k 147gr jhp with 3.3 TG @ 1.150", which is even fairly long. They make 135PF in my G34, and work in everything, even direct blowback guns like my AR. Still very much subsonic @ 920 Fps and quiet through the cans...

if if that's a lead or plated, 3.1 or 2.3 might work, esp if you reduce that length a bit...

-rvb

 

[Thegeek]

It's not light. The poly coated bullets use lead load data. Just started at the recommended and need to work up.

 

[GIJEW]

FWIW my understanding is that if using plated bullets, you're 'max' is somewhere between the high end of lead and middle of jacketed data. This correct? Likewise, I read somewhere (Dillon catalog?) that you shouldn't load plated bullets above +/- 1150fps. Thoughts?

 

[EyeCarry]

I'm glad I read this thread. I recently purchased some Titegroup and was planning to start at 3.5 gr. behind 124 gr. lead cast. Anyone see any problems? The book says 3.3 min and 3.7 max. At 3.5 it should be around 1050 fps. According to the book.

"I'm glad I read this thread." Me too. Some good/interesting ideas here. This recipe is right at what I am loading for SNS coated. 3.5, 125, 1.131-1.135

 

[S8MS-01904]

Do ya think 3.1grains Titegroup for 147RN SNS would make power factor?

 

[bgcatty]

Do ya think 3.1grains Titegroup for 147RN SNS would make power factor?

You have to be very vigilant loading 147grn bullets especially dealing with COAL. You should really determine COAL using plunk test to make sure the bullet is seated to correct depth. A chronograph is essential to working up loads.

 

[ru44mag]

"I'm glad I read this thread." Me too. Some good/interesting ideas here. This recipe is right at what I am loading for SNS coated. 3.5, 125, 1.131-1.135

I went ahead and loaded 50 rounds at 3.7. Used my Lee auto-drum. They were actually all over the place. Anywhere from 3.5 to 3.8. I need to just dump the Unique out of the Hornady powder measure and use it next time.

 

[EyeCarry]

I went ahead and loaded 50 rounds at 3.7. Used my Lee auto-drum. They were actually all over the place. Anywhere from 3.5 to 3.8. I need to just dump the Unique out of the Hornady powder measure and use it next time.

Hmmm.... My Lee disk is really consistent with Titegroup.

 

[jblomenberg16]

FWIW I've worked up to 4.5gr Titegroup with 115gr Montana Golds in my 9mm pistols. I started at 4.0 and had the same dirty brass you mentioned, and gradually worked up based on what my Lee Autodisk would drop.

Its probably something like 4.45 as when I do some q.c. on it sometimes the electronic sale weights 4.4 and sometimes 4.5.

 

[turnerdye1]

I run 4.5gr with 124gr bullets. I like to load my a little warm so my training ammo is more like my carry ammo

 

[ru44mag]

I run 4.5gr with 124gr bullets. I like to load my a little warm so my training ammo is more like my carry ammo

Are those bullets jacketed?

 

[rvb]

Do ya think 3.1grains Titegroup for 147RN SNS would make power factor?

Sounds about right, but depends on the gun and oal, etc. I hate to guess wo a chrono

 

[ViperJock]

Do ya think 3.1grains Titegroup for 147RN SNS would make power factor?

i think I rand mine with 3.4 grains to make power. It's been a wile since I loaded 147 though.

 

[turnerdye1]

Are those bullets jacketed?

Nope. RMR plated