Why are .380s so darn quirky?

[LP1]

.380s are quirky due to their small size. It's hard to make something small and reliable. If a .380 pistol is the same size as a 9mm, very few people would buy it since the cartridge is less powerful and more costly.

BTW, I have an LCP that has worked flawlessly for several years and several hundred rounds.

 

[VERT]

Just curious. How does the short barrel 9mm "pocket size" guns compare in "quirkiness" to the 380s?

I've not read where the small 9mm's have the same amount of problems like the 380's.

Well even the pocket 9mm are still a bit larger. The M&P shield and XDs for example have 3.3" barrels if my memory is working correctly. Also the 9mm guns weigh more, operate from a locked breech and the cartridges I assume operate at higher pressure. I would have to look up some load data to see exactly what the difference are.

 

[singlesix]

Only one 380, Bersa, and I haven't had any issues (now watch it have all kinds of issues), fired maybe 300 rounds so far.

 

[sopwith21]

My experience, FWIW...

Walther PPK (Interarms) - Had reliability issues with the gun when new. Took it to a gunsmith for feed ramp work, after which it performed admirably with any ammunition. Changed the grips later and had clearance issues with the slide. With the stock grips re-installed, the gun once again fed fine. Moral of story - have the ramp work done and leave it in stock condition and the gun is accurate and reliable and lives up to its legendary reputation.

Browning BDA (Beretta 84) - A few jams that I chalked up to either limp wristing or lousy aftermarket mags. When I grip the gun firmly and use only factory mags, it is 100% reliable. And I love the 13 rounds! Feels great in the hand, excellent balance. Wonderful gun, but yes, for its size you might consider moving up in caliber.

Bersa Thunder - Not as accurate as either the Walther or Browning and certainly doesn't have the style and cache, but is reliable as sunrise right out of the box.

CZ 82/83 - Utterly reliable with any ammo. The Soviet stuff is built with wider tolerances with an emphasis on absolute reliability, and they got it right. Nice to have 12 rounds available as well, but the gun is a bit heavy.

 

[BigRed3588]

Well even the pocket 9mm are still a bit larger. The M&P shield and XDs for example have 3.3" barrels if my memory is working correctly. Also the 9mm guns weigh more, operate from a locked breech and the cartridges I assume operate at higher pressure. I would have to look up some load data to see exactly what the difference are.

This might lend credence to the earlier comment that it has to do with the blowback design found in most .380s. IIRC, the Model 84/Browning BDA that other posters have mentioned as reliable have a locked breech.

 

[dhw9am]

2004 Bersa Thunder 380 - 1650 rounds, not one issue, NOT ONE.
2014 Taurus PT 738 - 275 rounds with both FMJ and Hp ammo, not one issue.
Don't know how good you want to get.

 

[Stschil]

I tend to agree with the size thing. We have a CZ83 that never had and issue. It is of course a large heavy gun to be a .380 though. As far as limp wristing, I am not so sure. People seem to blame that a lot when I am not sure it is the case. My wife was having problems with our Glock 42 feeding. Of course I thought it was limp wristing because the gun is 100% for me. SO I took it and shot it one handed holding it as loose as I could without it falling to the ground. Not one issue with it through four mags of holding it that way. A real head scratcher.

The wife has a PK380 that I can make have a FTF with just my grip. It definitely is prone to limp wristing as it runs fine otherwise. I will add, however, that it has gotten much better as it was broken in. Can't say much about the LCP I got her for Christmas. I've only put about 50 rounds through it over several trips down wheezer hill behind my house to my humble range. It hasn't failed during those times, but I've never really given it any challenge either.
I have used CCI Lawman FMJ and Ficochi JHP.

 

[VERT]

We got rid of my wife's PK380 because I felt it was too quirky. It was very accurate and would run some ammo fine. Puked consistently with WWB, S&B, Federal AE & Champion and TulAmmo. Ran perfectly with Federal HydraShok, PPU, CCI Blazer and Remington UMC. Not interested in owning any ammo picky, grip picky or technique picky guns.

Too answer the question about how reliable does a gun have to be. I almost got rid of a Smith & Wesson Performance Center 1911 because it failed once (possibly twice) in one day of firing 500 rounds. 2 failures in 500 prompted me to start testing magazine and ammo combinations until I figured out the problem. If I had not figured out the problem I would have been very tempted to dump the gun at a considerable loss and invested in a different gun. Now I will be the first to admit that I will put up with more then most given that I will feed my guns anything and don't re-lube as often as I should. I expect an occasional hiccup.

 

[ryan3030]

No issues with my PPK/s yet

100 more rounds on the way of a different maker. I'll see if I can make it fail.

 

[jsharmon7]

I've never had any malfunctions out of my P238. I've had several different people shoot it and they had no problems either. I do agree with you that, in general, most .380s are built to a lower price point. They are also built to be pocket guns and therefore small and light. It's better than a rimfire at least.

 

[Archer]

Never had issue 1 with the Bersa Thunder, Thunder CC, Makarov .380, or Sig 238 I've owned.

 

[ModernGunner]

Like owner, like gun?

 

[FERLACH]

I have a P3AT and about 300 rds later, it has never jammed.

 

[indiucky]

Also short barrel autos in general seem to cause problems. My new reformed opinion is that autos with less then 3.25" barrels are officially off my list.

When the sig P6 (225) was announced it was billed as "the first reliable compact service round semi automatic" and it seems huge compared to what we are seeing out there now....You have reached the same conclusion Jeff Cooper came to....It was sometime in the 80's when the sub compact, chopped 1911's starting coming out and I remember Mr. Cooper did not have much nice to say about them..(for the reason you stated)...He felt that Commander sized semi autos was as small as someone should go in a semi automatic...Times have changed (with the proliferation of sub compact service round pistols) but I stick to that rule on my semi autos and stay with revolvers when needing something "compact''"

IMHO ofcourse......