Why IL resident can NOT bring handgun to IN range

[jdgatliff]

NOPE you are misinterpreting the law.

There are overlapping laws that make things very confusing. An IL resident can travel THROUGH the state of Indiana with a handgun but not TO the state of Indiana with a handgun . . . as per the determination of the D.N.R.

Federal law protects travelers who are traveling through a jurisdiction. However if you are traveling to somewhere there is a potential problem. The D.N.R. has determined that Federal law does not protect someone who is traveling TO a range in Indiana but rather that the person must comply with INDIANA law. Indiana law requires a license/permit to carry a gun, and that includes transporting it to a gun range within the state. Therefore someone traveling from IL to IN to a gun range much be 'carrying' and therefore must comply with IN law.

Probably the easiest license to get that would allow a non-Hoosier to carry in the state of Indiana is the PA non-resident permit. Unlike the Utah or FLA permits, the PA permit does not require training so its quicker to attain but is far more limited than the other two popular permits.






RIGHT, no carry, not even to the range.

But its legal for an Illinois resident to bring a gun to Indiana if that resident is staying in a hotel room in Indiana. Its not legal to remove it from the hotel room, except to continue a journey, or to return home.

So if he was bringing the gun to a friends private property in Indiana where he can legally posses it then FOPA would cover him then right? The only reason it doesn't apply in this case is because he can't legally posses it at the range without a LTCH right?

 

[ATM]

OK all thanks for the info. I think I have a better grasp of the answer.
How does this sound.

[Note the event in question is the NWI Meet & Shoot held at Winamc (a DNR Range)]

Q: I live in IL and would like to attend the event. Can I bring my guns as well?
Everyone is welcome to attend. Winamac is a free public range. Please note that non-Indiana residents must have a license or permit to carry a handgun from [strike]either Indiana or another state that Indiana recognizes (see here for more info)[/strike] anywhere in the universe in order to bring their handguns to the range. The IL FOID card DOES NOT count to meet this requirement. You CAN bring [strike]a[/strike] long guns (rifles and shotguns) WITHOUT a license/permit...or make arrangements to transport handguns according to 18 U.S.C. 926A to a local place of repair and meet with a license holder willing to transport them to the range and maintain constructive possession for you throughout the days activities.

My suggestions in blue.

 

[ATM]

So if he was bringing the gun to a friends private property in Indiana where he can legally posses it...

Wait... why do you think he can legally possess a handgun in IN on his friend's private property?

IN law makes no exception for that without a license or permit.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Here's my question, could an IL resident transport a handgun to a friends private property to sell him the handgun?

 

[ATM]

Here's my question, could an IL resident transport a handgun to a friends private property to sell him the handgun?

IN law makes no exception for transporting to a place of sale without license/permit - only from place of sale to home/fixed place of business.

 

[sj kahr k40]

IN law makes no exception for transporting to a place of sale without license/permit - only from place of sale to home/fixed place of business.

Then I guess my idea won't work

 

[ATM]

Then I guess my idea won't work

[strike]
It would if they chose a place of repair as the place of sale/purchase.

See earlier note in blue.
[/strike]

EDIT: for actual sale/purchase across state lines, an FFL transfer would be required.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Do gunsmiths have to be licensed in this state, I wonder if, I'm taking to my friends house so he can fix it, would satisfy the requirement

 

[jdgatliff]

Wait... why do you think he can legally possess a handgun in IN on his friend's private property?

IN law makes no exception for that without a license or permit.

"
FEDERAL LAW ON TRANSPORTATION OF FIREARMS
A provision of the federal law known as the Firearms Owners’ Protection Act, or FOPA, protects those who are transporting firearms for lawful purposes from local restrictions which would otherwise prohibit passage.
Under FOPA, notwithstanding any state or local law, a person is entitled to transport a firearm from any place where he or she may lawfully possess such firearm to any other place where he or she may lawfully possess it, if the firearm is unloaded and locked out of reach. In vehicles without a trunk, the unloaded firearm shall be in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console. Ammunition that is either locked out of reach in the trunk or in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console is also covered. FOPA also seems to provide for necessary stops, like gasoline and rest."

NRA-ILA ::

If he is coming to a place in Indiana where he can legally posses it then FOPA should cover him. Unless Indiana has a law that says you must have a LTCH on private property or be the property owner to legally possess to firearm there, then it's a legal place to carry the weapon if the landowner says so.


Unless I'm completely misinterpreting this law FOPA should apply to the above and not apply to the OP since he can't legally possess it at a DNR range.

 

[jdgatliff]

Ok never mind I re read IN code.

IC 35-47-2-1
Carrying a handgun without a license or by person convicted of domestic battery
Sec. 1. (a) Except as provided in subsection (b) and section 2 of this chapter, a person shall not carry a handgun in any vehicle or on or about the person's body, except in the person's dwelling, on the person's property or fixed place of business, without a license issued under this chapter being in the person's possession.

I lived in Texas and got really familiar with their laws and keep confusing and mixing them up with Indiana laws.

 

[melensdad]

Here's my question, could an IL resident transport a handgun to a friends private property to sell him the handgun?

No because that would constitute an illegal interstate transfer.

IN law makes no exception for transporting to a place of sale without license/permit - only from place of sale to home/fixed place of business.

Which is why an IL resident can transport to a hotel room in the state of Indiana while on vacation, but not to a public gun range in the state for use during target practice.

It would if they chose a place of repair as the place of sale/purchase.

See earlier note in blue.

ONLY IF the gunsmith agreed to do the interstate transfer. Again the question above was predicated on an interstate sale.

Do gunsmiths have to be licensed in this state, I wonder if, I'm taking to my friends house so he can fix it, would satisfy the requirement

Yes gunsmiths have FFL's.



BEAR IN MIND that if the ILLINOIS resident is "traveling to" a point in Indiana that is private property, such as a farm, and he "stays" on such private property while he is in Indiana, then he would 1) legally be able to transport the gun to such place under FEDERAL LAW, and he would 2) legally be able to shoot his handgun in Indiana while ON THAT PRIVATE PROPERTY since he is residing on that property (again under FEDERAL LAW and under INDIANA LAW).

 

[ATM]

ONLY IF the gunsmith agreed to do the interstate transfer. Again the question above was predicated on an interstate sale.

Good catch. Edit noted on that post.

 

[singlestacksig]

indiana law procides for a non resident to get a LTCH.



IC 35-47-2-3
Application for license to carry handgun; procedure

 

[ATM]

indiana law procides for a non resident to get a LTCH.

IC 35-47-2-3
Application for license to carry handgun; procedure

But only available under the following circumstance:

IC 35-47-2-3

...(a)(3) if the applicant is a resident of another state and has a regular place of business or employment in Indiana...

 

[wolfman]

Incorrect ,,,, even though there are a couple of exceptions, as a general rule, Indiana DOES NOT issue non res LTCH's.

Actually, YOU are the one who is incorrect.
The State does issue a NON-Resident LTCH. Try again...

So are you saying that anyone and/or everyone that is not an Indiana resident can obtain a NON-Resident LTCH?

 

[Coach]

If Illinois just issued a LTCH then this whole thread and issue would not exist. The Wall came down but communism is still around.

 

[melensdad]

So are you saying that anyone and/or everyone that is not an Indiana resident can obtain a NON-Resident LTCH?

Not my understanding at all. IF you are not a resident you will not get an INDIANA LTCH unless you meet very specific criteria (you own a store in Indiana or work in an establishment in Indiana-presumably that requires or allows you to carry a gun) and even then I suspect that they don't issue many of those.

 

[IndyGunSafety]

Which is why an IL resident can transport to a hotel room in the state of Indiana while on vacation, but not to a public gun range in the state for use during target practice.


BEAR IN MIND that if the ILLINOIS resident is "traveling to" a point in Indiana that is private property, such as a farm, and he "stays" on such private property while he is in Indiana, then he would 1) legally be able to transport the gun to such place under FEDERAL LAW, and he would 2) legally be able to shoot his handgun in Indiana while ON THAT PRIVATE PROPERTY since he is residing on that property (again under FEDERAL LAW and under INDIANA LAW).

I disagree that FOPA covers you in a hotel room if you stop and don't have a license. There's tons of case law examples online. Here's one: The Volokh Conspiracy Unexpected Flight Delay => Hotel Stay => Criminal Prosecution for Gun Possession

FOPA SAYS:

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.

You can't transport in this state without a license. If you stop at a HOTEL FOPA does not cover you.

I'm gonna ask the expert on this one. I'll let you know what I find out.
​

 

[melensdad]

I disagree that FOPA covers you in a hotel room if you stop and don't have a license. There's tons of case law examples online. Here's one: The Volokh Conspiracy Unexpected Flight Delay => Hotel Stay => Criminal Prosecution for Gun Possession

FOPA SAYS:

Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.

You can't transport in this state without a license. If you stop at a HOTEL FOPA does not cover you.

I'm gonna ask the expert on this one. I'll let you know what I find out.
​

We have to realize that the case law you cited was in a jursidiction where it is illegal to have a handgun without a license. That is not the case here in Indiana. There is no license for possession. There is case law showing that staying in a hotel is equal to residing in your home, and you are allowed to protect your home and possess a gun within your home. Therefore you have met the requirement of FROM anyplace where you may lawfully possess TO anyplace where you may lawfully possess since its legal to possess inside a home (hotel).

Consequently I believe your argument is misguided and false.

 

[IndyGunSafety]

We have to realize that the case law you cited was in a jursidiction where it is illegal to have a handgun without a license. That is not the case here in Indiana. There is no license for possession. There is case law showing that staying in a hotel is equal to residing in your home, and you are allowed to protect your home and possess a gun within your home. Therefore you have met the requirement of FROM anyplace where you may lawfully possess TO anyplace where you may lawfully possess since its legal to possess inside a home (hotel).

Consequently I believe your argument is misguided and false.

So you are of the opinion that a person without a license may transport a handgun to a hotel in Indiana? Please show me the IC that provides for transport of a firearm without a license, considering there is no purchase here. If I understand you correctly you are saying FOPA covers the transport part, and IC covers the hotel?