Why the M&P won't be replacing my Glock 19

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • esrice

    Certified Regular Guy
    Rating - 100%
    20   0   0
    Jan 16, 2008
    24,095
    48
    Indy
    The only thing that doesn't fit quite right is the trigger. I should say the reach of the trigger is too close to the grip frame for my hands. It's designed for someone with much smaller hands than mine. I am forced to hook my trigger finger over the trigger which is something I don't really like doing and it feels odd to me.

    As someone with smaller hands, this was one aspect that actually drew me to the M&P from Glock.

    The culprit?

    :nailbite:

    Are you concerned at all about aftermarket support for the Caracal? Do they make night sights for them? Are extra magazines available or expensive? Holsters? Who fixes them if they break? Your video was the first I have heard of this new pistol so I'm curious.
     

    MilitaryArms

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Apr 19, 2008
    2,751
    48
    There is no aftermarket support for the Caracal, yet. But I don't typically buy a whole lot of aftermarket accessories anyway.

    I had Raven make me a holster, it's my favorite concealment holster so I got lucky there.

    I just picked up two mags at Blythes this weekend for $23 each. I saw them hanging on the wall. I'll snag more when I see them.

    Caracal USA is up and running so I would go to them for service or parts.

    They have undergone more stringent testing than most other pistols out there. The UAE has the money to build these things right, and they're sparing no expense. They're also aggressively tackling most markets (outside of the US).
     

    Txlur

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    36   0   0
    Aug 17, 2011
    544
    18
    NWI
    I'd like to try the compact Caracal. I'm just worried about those rear sights.

    If they run like my G19 and the trigger is better, and it feels ok, then I don't see a reason that I wouldn't switch over, if the support catches up.
     

    MilitaryArms

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Apr 19, 2008
    2,751
    48
    No need, my Glock runs just fine.
    I get where you're coming from... a man with one gun is a dangerous man because he knows how to use it.

    But life for me would be way too bland if I lived it that way. I have lots of guns because I enjoy learning about them and shooting them. I do, however, only carry one gun as my primary defensive weapon (with the BUG here and there) and it's the one I shoot weekly to stay in practice.

    That's my G19.

    I honestly don't need to change my daily carry gun to something else. My EXO G19 is well suited for the task. I have several G19's that I've cycled through my holster until I landed on the EXO (nickle boron treated slide and barrel). But I hate to think something slightly better is out there and I'm not considering it.

    There's a very good change, better than 50/50, that I won't switch my daily carry to something else. But I constantly evaluate what's on the market and compare it to my carry gun. If nothing else, it's fun and keeps me abreast of the latest and greatest pistols on the market.
     

    mettle

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Nov 15, 2008
    4,224
    36
    central southern IN
    I have been thinking hard about making the switch from a Glock 19 for daily carry to the M&P 9.

    I've been evaluating the handguns side by side for several months now and have decided the M&P won't be my next daily carry gun.

    I started considering the M&P because of how good it felt in my hands. It's not perfect, mind you, but it seemed to be more ergonomic than most other pistols in its class in most areas, except for one (for me). I also liked that it doesn't use a polygonal barrel so it's safe for me to shoot my lead target loads without having to swap barrels.

    The grip fits my large hands perfectly. The only thing that doesn't fit quite right is the trigger. I should say the reach of the trigger is too close to the grip frame for my hands. It's designed for someone with much smaller hands than mine. I am forced to hook my trigger finger over the trigger which is something I don't really like doing and it feels odd to me. But I was trying to get used to it. That alone may not have prevented me from adopting the M&P as my daily carry gun. There's one more problem with the trigger.

    I dislike the trigger itself. It's creepy, lets off all the way back where it's practically touching the grip frame (see my comments above about it already being too short) and it lacks a reset that I can feel or hear. The issues with the trigger keeps me from shooting the M&P as well as I do my Glocks. Even when dry firing, no matter how careful I am with my trigger control, when it lets off I can see the sights move slightly. With my Glocks the sights remain rock solid on the target, so this tells me something with the ergonomics and the trigger are conspiring to make super accurate aimed fire difficult for me with the pistol.

    I can easily keep them in the kill zone on a man size target and the pistol is more than accurate enough for me in terms of self defense, it's not like I can't keep the rounds where they belong. But I also like to target shoot with my pistols to keep myself sharp with my carry gun, and I can't shoot the M&P as well as I can my Glocks.

    I know I can install an aftermarket trigger to fix the short comings of the M&P's trigger but I'm not into installing aftermarket fire control parts into my carry guns. Sights, grips, and other non-critical components I'll swap out but not critical parts like trigger components. I know, it may seem goofy but it's a comfort thing for me.

    I'll keep my M&P 9, it's a very good firearm. I'm also pulling for the M&P in the US military trials. But unfortunately, the gun just isn't well suited for my daily carry gun when I don't feel it's superior to the one I already have.

    Plus... something else has popped onto my radar in the last couple of months. This something pushed the M&P out of the running and is now being considered as my future CCW gun. It has several more months of evaluation to go before it gets that honor but the last two months of shooting it has shown me that better alternatives are on the market that don't require me to make concessions on things like the trigger. This new contender has a very Glock like trigger that's a bit lighter and more crisp than a factory Glock trigger. It also fits my hand much better in the trigger reach department, it mirrors the feel of a Glock. It also has a more ergonomic grip than the Glock, but not quite as ergonomic as the M&P... but it is a marked improvement in ergonomics when compared to the Glock. It also features an ambi-mag release.

    The culprit?

    i-XKvTp7f-L.jpg


    :nailbite:

    Good post. The m&p is another offering out there but I'm not interested in following the.latest in fads.
     

    lovemachine

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    17   0   0
    Dec 14, 2009
    15,601
    119
    Indiana
    You can't beat the reliability of a Glock. I EDC a G19 as well.

    I tried the M&P9c as well. I really liked it, once I put $200 into making the trigger more like a Glock :D

    I always went back to my G19. So I sold the M&P and got a Glock 26.

    I think I made a smart decision :D
     

    mettle

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Nov 15, 2008
    4,224
    36
    central southern IN
    I just don't see buying a handgun knowing you have to put more money in it just to make it better.
    (Adding money into trigger)
    Modding is one thing, but buying with knowledge you have to fix something is not what I want to do
     

    jgreiner

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Jul 13, 2011
    5,099
    38
    Lafayette, IN
    I just don't see buying a handgun knowing you have to put more money in it just to make it better.
    (Adding money into trigger)
    Modding is one thing, but buying with knowledge you have to fix something is not what I want to do

    that is why I suggested shooting a Pro. If you are in the Lafayette area anytime, you are welcome to shoot mine.
     

    DustyDawg48

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    10   0   0
    May 11, 2010
    3,935
    38
    Mount Vernon
    I've seen one of those Caracal autos and it does feel good. I think the Glock trigger is probably the best of the poly bunch where the M&P just feels the best out of them all.

    I'm still a Glock fan but I'm carrying and shooting my M&P9 Pro and M&P45 more than any other even my beloved Glock 21. The beavertail or tang on the M&P frame has as much to do with it as anything since the smaller frame Glocks will absolutely the webbing of my hands to shreds. I still have a few scars where the slide had sawed back and forth across it during some shooting. When they finally introduce a Gen4 backstrap that incorporates an actual beavertail I'll be owning a few more Glocks.

    Have you done a review video of the Caracal just yet?
     

    MilitaryArms

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Apr 19, 2008
    2,751
    48
    I saw your Caracal review video (great vid). You aren't concerned with the sub par job it did in the mud test though?
    I don't believe its performance was sub-par. Most handguns would fail being stomped into such a soupy mud hole (I did it 3 times, the video shows the 3rd dunk). The Caracal was packed full of mud, even the magazine. No firearm I've done that to has worked 100% afterwards.

    What is telling is that with a quick splash in river bed water (mucky water) it returned to 100% service.

    I've had pistols like the Beretta M9 choke on mud, then remain out of service after being sloshed around in water several times. The M9 didn't return to 100% service until it was stripped and cleaned with CLP.
     
    Top Bottom