Your Marion County Tax Dollars At Work

[Destro]

Funny, I didn't use either of those terms last time I was in Alabama Street.

The third time the officious prick held my DL up to my face at check in I called him everything BUT a "CO", although there was a c-word.

nothing gets past the specials...

 

[Blackhawk2001]

Well damn, I hate to be a cop-basher and all, but some of the "special" deputies who serve warrants are certified LEAs - not 30 hour Special Deputies like I was - with actual law enforcement experience. Some of 'em are retired IMPD. Yeah, when I worked in Public Safety (Emergency Management) I was well aware of the dichotomy between ILEA-qualified Sheriff Deputies and IPD-trained officers, but both groups seemed to get the job done. Some of those same folks are working the streets today doing the things mandated to the Sheriff, not IMPD.

I've been in a position to notice all the goofy things that an elected Sheriff apparently gets injected into his DNA after a successful election - Frank Anderson was looking into getting a helicopter for the Sheriff's Department right after the IPD got their new one - and I recognize the ego involved in expanding the manpower of a department that doesn't have an "emergency response" mission, but that's what we get for having a constitutionally elected Sheriff and politicking him out of his traditional job.

You IMPD guys remind me of the Air Force vs Army fixed wing rivalry. The Air Force wouldn't let the Army have combat fixed wing aircraft, then *****ed when they had to provide close air support to ground units AND *****ed when the Army started arming its own aviation assets - helicopters. Maybe you should just accept that the Sheriff is a constitutional entity unto himself; stop *****ing about the assets he's acquired; and start looking harder for ways to get funding for your needs. Or - here's a thought. Maybe you could push for more acceptance of civilians carrying handguns and taking care of themselves so you wouldn't need 2500 officers on the streets. Just a thought.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Let's see...IMPD (solely responsible for policing Indianapolis outside of the smaller towns)is 685 officers short of where we should be according to the DOJ with no money to hire additional officers. MCSO has 703 deputies getting paid to wear uniforms, drive patrol cars and carry guns but have no jurisdictional or patrol responsibilities.

Seems like some really smart person somewhere could probably sit down with a pad of paper, stack of pencils and a good calculator and come up with a solution to the problem.

Politicians have been trying and their solution is to raise taxes. I don't claim to be a genius but I just have this gnawing feeling that more money might not be the best solution. Maybe I'm weird or mentally handicapped and just don't know it.

THIS exactly. I've had MCSD back me up one night, and just assumed it was HCSD guy... until I say the Charger. I wanted to say something, but thought better of it.

 

[Kutnupe14]

...and where is their academy? They don't go to either of the ILEA's, and I'm pretty sure they don't go to 10th.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

...and where is their academy? They don't go to either of the ILEA's, and I'm pretty sure they don't go to 10th.

They have their own academy but share the building at 901 N Post Rd.

 

[drillsgt]

Don't be haters, IMPD can be in the next magazine article.

 

[DRob]

You think the Sheriff having a SWAT team now is scary? Anybody still have the video of the pre-merger MCSD SWAT guys shooting at each other as a SUV drives between them? That was an Oh-**** moment if there ever was one!

Found it! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmMVExRF9FQ

 

[phylodog]

Well damn, I hate to be a cop-basher and all, but some of the "special" deputies who serve warrants are certified LEAs - not 30 hour Special Deputies like I was - with actual law enforcement esperience. Some of 'em are retired IMPD. Yeah, when I worked in Public Safety (Emergency Management) I was well aware of the dichotomy between ILEA-qualified Sheriff Deputies and IPD-trained officers, but both groups seemed to get the job done. Some of those same folks are working the streets today doing the things mandated to the Sheriff, not IMPD.

I've been in a position to notice all the goofy things that an elected Sheriff apparently gets injected into his DNA after a successful election - Frank Anderson was looking into getting a helicopter for the Sheriff's Department right after the IPD got their new one - and I recognize the ego involved in expanding the manpower of a department that doesn't have an "emergency response" mission, but that's what we get for having a constitutionally elected Sheriff and politicking him out of his traditional job.

Frank Anderson lied, fell for the "okie doke" and politiced himself out of his position.

You IMPD guys remind me of the Air Force vs Army fixed wing rivalry. The Air Force wouldn't let the Army have combat fixed wing aircraft, then *****ed when they had to provide close air support to ground units AND *****ed when the Army started arming its own aviation assets - helicopters. Maybe you should just accept that the Sheriff is a constitutional entity unto himself; stop *****ing about the assets he's acquired; and start looking harder for ways to get funding for your needs. Or - here's a thought. Maybe you could push for more acceptance of civilians carrying handguns and taking care of themselves so you wouldn't need 2500 officers on the streets. Just a thought.

Know any current IMPD officers? If so, you might want to ask them about the current training, put together by yours truly, about this very subject before making assumptions that the agency is against citizens carrying firearms.

I'm sorry but apparently you've missed the intent of my posts here. I could give a **** less what the Marion County Sheriff's Department does. This thread was created to bring to light the fact that the MCSO is pissing away millions and millions of dollars to purchase equipment that his employees have no need for to complete the responsibilities required of his agency according to the law. The merger stripped the MCSO of their patrol responsibilities, period. Outfitting his deputies to do this is a complete and total waste of tax money, tax money that should be spent to properly fund the agency that is responsible for patrolling the streets and providing for public safety. I even went so far as to recommend that the prior MCSD jurisdiction be given back to the MCSD. This is the only solution that makes sense for the taxpayers and solves the manpower issues of IMPD (and shuts the Mayor down on his demands for more tax money).

I don't care if some of the MCSO employees are ILEA certified, they still do not meet the letter of the law to act in the capacity of a police officer in this state due to their current employer and the restrictions put in place by the merger. I say fix it. Change the law. Give the Sheriff back the patrol responsibilities he so desperately wants. It solves all of our big problems. My opinion is that is will create a whole bunch of new ones for those living in the Sheriffs jurisdiction but that isn't my concern, I didn't vote for him.

 

[drillsgt]

I'm sorry but apparently you've missed the intent of my posts here. I could give a **** less what the Marion County Sheriff's Department does. This thread was created to bring to light the fact that the MCSO is pissing away millions and millions of dollars to purchase equipment that his employees have no need for to complete the responsibilities required of his agency according to the law. The merger stripped the MCSO of their patrol responsibilities, period. Outfitting his deputies to do this is a complete and total waste of tax money, tax money that should be spent to properly fund the agency that is responsible for patrolling the streets and providing for public safety. I even went so far as to recommend that the prior MCSD jurisdiction be given back to the MCSD. This is the only solution that makes sense for the taxpayers and solves the manpower issues of IMPD (and shuts the Mayor down on his demands for more tax money).

I don't care if some of the MCSO employees are ILEA certified, they still do not meet the letter of the law to act in the capacity of a police officer in this state due to their current employer and the restrictions put in place by the merger. I say fix it. Change the law. Give the Sheriff back the patrol responsibilities he so desperately wants. It solves all of our big problems. My opinion is that is will create a whole bunch of new ones for those living in the Sheriffs jurisdiction but that isn't my concern, I didn't vote for him.

Makes sense to me. Where's the ISP in the manpower issue? I know in MI by buddy works for MSP and he patrols Flint, not I-69 but the high crime areas or anywhere needed for that matter. They take all local calls right along with FPD and the Sheriff's department. Does ISP allocate resources for the city?

 

[phylodog]

Not really. There are a handful of ISP guys assigned to the Indy area but they stay pretty busy on the interstates most of the time. I have had them assist on a run occasionally but there aren't enough of them to make much of a difference.

They do come in with numbers for large events and play a big role in managing those, we're glad to have them.

 

[Denny347]

Well damn, I hate to be a cop-basher and all, but some of the "special" deputies who serve warrants are certified LEAs - not 30 hour Special Deputies like I was - with actual law enforcement experience. Some of 'em are retired IMPD. Yeah, when I worked in Public Safety (Emergency Management) I was well aware of the dichotomy between ILEA-qualified Sheriff Deputies and IPD-trained officers, but both groups seemed to get the job done. Some of those same folks are working the streets today doing the things mandated to the Sheriff, not IMPD.

I've been in a position to notice all the goofy things that an elected Sheriff apparently gets injected into his DNA after a successful election - Frank Anderson was looking into getting a helicopter for the Sheriff's Department right after the IPD got their new one - and I recognize the ego involved in expanding the manpower of a department that doesn't have an "emergency response" mission, but that's what we get for having a constitutionally elected Sheriff and politicking him out of his traditional job.

You IMPD guys remind me of the Air Force vs Army fixed wing rivalry. The Air Force wouldn't let the Army have combat fixed wing aircraft, then *****ed when they had to provide close air support to ground units AND *****ed when the Army started arming its own aviation assets - helicopters. Maybe you should just accept that the Sheriff is a constitutional entity unto himself; stop *****ing about the assets he's acquired; and start looking harder for ways to get funding for your needs. Or - here's a thought. Maybe you could push for more acceptance of civilians carrying handguns and taking care of themselves so you wouldn't need 2500 officers on the streets. Just a thought.

I was hired on as a Merit Deputy with MCSD and was damn proud of it and sickened to have been given away so easily by the same man that promised us (to our faces) that he would never agree to a merged department...until Peterson dangled the control of ALL law enforcement in Marion County...then he was all for it. I am dismayed at what my beloved department has become...a shell of its former self. It is like that 70yr old ex-Playmate that is trying desperately to relive the days of old...it's sad and kinda creepy. I have lots of friends who are Special Deputies, they are great guys/gals. I don't like what their leadership is doing. He has a jail that is hemorrhaging CO's because they work long hours and are WAY understaffed. Hmmm, a jail that (according to CO's I'm friends with) is at extremely dangerous low levels of COs but has no problem adding bodies to warrants. That is because they have high visibility and CO's don't. Some of the guys serving warrants USED to be certified officers/deputies but yes, they are retired. Now they are Specials. There are a few but the vast majority are young people with no street experience.

 

[Denny347]

Well all the time! We still have a warrant team, a sex offender compliance team and several others. We have a lot of cars on the road, the meger was just that it took the MCSO road deputies at the time and merged only them with IPD. So before you make comments please have your facts straight.

For the last 20yrs, the MCSD warrant team consisted of a handful of people in the FTA office and the rest of us served the warrants in our beats. It usually worked out well since we knew many of the people and where they hide. Now, the MCSD warrant team exploded in size and we are no longer allowed to serve warrants in our beats. Make work for the new warrant team. Warrants DOES NOT need a SWAT (I mean STAR) team when a much better equipped SWAT team already exists. Why the duplication?

 

[Denny347]

Makes sense to me. Where's the ISP in the manpower issue? I know in MI by buddy works for MSP and he patrols Flint, not I-69 but the high crime areas or anywhere needed for that matter. They take all local calls right along with FPD and the Sheriff's department. Does ISP allocate resources for the city?

Hell, many times we are called to runs on the interstate because ISP has no one working or is busy.

 

[drillsgt]

Not really. There are a handful of ISP guys assigned to the Indy area but they stay pretty busy on the interstates most of the time. I have had them assist on a run occasionally but there aren't enough of them to make much of a difference.

They do come in with numbers for large events and play a big role in managing those, we're glad to have them.

Makes sense, Flint is a much smaller city.

 

[drillsgt]

Hell, many times we are called to runs on the interstate because ISP has no one working or is busy.

That's not good, maybe they aren't allocating their resources effectively. They always seem to have the stretch on 37 down to Bloomington on a pretty good lock down?

 

[drillsgt]

I was hired on as a Merit Deputy with MCSD and was damn proud of it and sickened to have been given away so easily by the same man that promised us (to our faces) that he would never agree to a merged department...until Peterson dangled the control of ALL law enforcement in Marion County...then he was all for it. I am dismayed at what my beloved department has become...a shell of its former self. It is like that 70yr old ex-Playmate that is trying desperately to relive the days of old...it's sad and kinda creepy. I have lots of friends who are Special Deputies, they are great guys/gals. I don't like what their leadership is doing. He has a jail that is hemorrhaging CO's because they work long hours and are WAY understaffed. Hmmm, a jail that (according to CO's I'm friends with) is at extremely dangerous low levels of COs but has no problem adding bodies to warrants. That is because they have high visibility and CO's don't. Some of the guys serving warrants USED to be certified officers/deputies but yes, they are retired. Now they are Specials. There are a few but the vast majority are young people with no street experience.

Inexperience plus executing warrants could equal the next youtube video or nasty news story.

 

[Denny347]

Inexperience plus executing warrants could equal the next youtube video or nasty news story.

True and without Merit protections, they are being placed into situations that could cost them their career and everything they own.

 

[Destro]

That's not good, maybe they aren't allocating their resources effectively. They always seem to have the stretch on 37 down to Bloomington on a pretty good lock down?

That is pretty much the norm all over the state, they never seem to have anybody on duty/close when they are needed

 

[Blackhawk2001]

For the last 20yrs, the MCSD warrant team consisted of a handful of people in the FTA office and the rest of us served the warrants in our beats. It usually worked out well since we knew many of the people and where they hide. Now, the MCSD warrant team exploded in size and we are no longer allowed to serve warrants in our beats. Make work for the new warrant team. Warrants DOES NOT need a SWAT (I mean STAR) team when a much better equipped SWAT team already exists. Why the duplication?

You answered that question in your previous post and in this post: politics. Besides, you guys are too busy responding to calls all over the city to be serving warrants; especially since you're understaffed, right?

 

[Denny347]

You answered that question in your previous post and in this post: politics. Besides, you guys are too busy responding to calls all over the city to be serving warrants; especially since you're understaffed, right?

It's part of the job. You call 911 saying Billy Bob has a warrant and is at xyz address I go and take care of my beat. If I have down time I look up pending warrants in my beat and go look for them. Now, I cannot look them up...they are in a super secret database I cannot access and the 911 calls never make it to me, they go straight to the warrant squad who may or may not even bother handling it. One day not long ago I chased a guy wanted on a felony warrant. Lost him. Looked for him all morning but he ducked into a friend's house we think. Not long after we call the perimeter a neighbor calls 911 saying the wanted man I was chasing was at xyz address. The run went straight to the warrant team but they never let us know they arrested him. I was still out looking for the guy days later, not knowing he was in jail and by the time I figured it out it was too late for me to charge him with resisting which I COULD have done if SOMEONE would have kept me in the loop on the arrest. I HATE loose ends. I subscribe to the old adage that "my beat is my responsibility."When I am working, I have my hand in ALL that is going on in my beat. I know the people and the going ons. I do not like people sneaking around on my beat, at best it is rude, at worst it is dangerous. I always found time for warrants before, the BS lost cell phone reports can pend.