China Vows To Open Fire on US Troops That Come to Taiwan’s Aid

[BehindBlueI's]

What is there to touch exactly? In the short term you're correct in the rationalization that'll likely be used in support of such appeasement. Long term, it seems likely that Taiwan is the current Sudetenland and the Biden administration is likely to play the role of a dumber, less honorable Neville Chamberlain. As you said, the loss of men and material is inevitable, appeasement doesn't change that inevitability, it only increases the cost.

Why we would suddenly shift gears and deploy the military for an independant Taiwan when our policy for years as been:

U.S. Relations With Taiwan - United States Department of State

U.S.-Taiwan Relationship As a leading democracy and a technological powerhouse, Taiwan is a key U.S. partner in the Indo-Pacific. Though the United States does not have diplomatic relations with Taiwan, we have a robust unofficial relationship. The United States and Taiwan share similar values...

www.state.gov

"The United States does not support Taiwan independence."

Date: 2018.

Trump's State Dept didn't see us going to war for Taiwan independence either, apparently. That's not as much fun as blaming Biden for everything or bumperstickering some of you voted for this, though, so it's ignored.

I don't see how losses would somehow be higher later, nor some inevitable shooting conflict. The Chinese are patient, one of the 'advantages' of an actual totalitarian regime is they can afford to be since they don't have to swing with popular opinion every 4 2/4/6 years. They are not all powerful, however, nor without internal dissent, which is the point of this propaganda. It's not aimed at the American consumer of outrage, we would assume soldiers would be treated as enemy combatants. It's aimed internally to show a lack of fear of the US and project power, which may or may not be real. China's one child policy has not been kind to their military capabilities. Combined with increased standards of living and human life isn't as cheap as it used to be for the rank and file.

 

[Mikey1911]

So you are saying it will be a (mostly) peaceful transition of power.

View attachment 171316

Pulitzer Prize winning photograph by Eddie Adams, with whom I share my home town.

 

[two70]

Why we would suddenly shift gears and deploy the military for an independant Taiwan when our policy for years as been:

U.S. Relations With Taiwan - United States Department of State

U.S.-Taiwan Relationship As a leading democracy and a technological powerhouse, Taiwan is a key U.S. partner in the Indo-Pacific. Though the United States does not have diplomatic relations with Taiwan, we have a robust unofficial relationship. The United States and Taiwan share similar values...

www.state.gov

"The United States does not support Taiwan independence."

Date: 2018.

Trump's State Dept didn't see us going to war for Taiwan independence either, apparently. That's not as much fun as blaming Biden for everything or bumperstickering some of you voted for this, though, so it's ignored.

I don't see how losses would somehow be higher later, nor some inevitable shooting conflict. The Chinese are patient, one of the 'advantages' of an actual totalitarian regime is they can afford to be since they don't have to swing with popular opinion every 4 2/4/6 years. They are not all powerful, however, nor without internal dissent, which is the point of this propaganda. It's not aimed at the American consumer of outrage, we would assume soldiers would be treated as enemy combatants. It's aimed internally to show a lack of fear of the US and project power, which may or may not be real. China's one child policy has not been kind to their military capabilities. Combined with increased standards of living and human life isn't as cheap as it used to be for the rank and file.

Oh, we likely won't. And that is likely to big a mistake that comes back to haunt us. Taiwan itself doesn't really matter, our response, or the lack thereof, is what will ultimately matter.

Are you under the mistaken impression that China will simply gobble up Taiwan and then be content? That everything will then return to the status quo?

 

[DadSmith]

Oh, we likely won't. And that is likely to big a mistake that comes back to haunt us. Taiwan itself doesn't really matter, our response, or the lack thereof, is what will ultimately matter.

Are you under the mistaken impression that China will simply gobble up Taiwan and then be content? That everything will then return to the status quo?

What is to stop then from taking over all the south Pacific islands? They would be well fortified probably better than what the Japanese did in WWII. Next is Midway and then on to Hawaii.

Stop them now or they may be on the west coast before long.

 

[two70]

What is to stop then from taking over all the south Pacific islands? They would be well fortified probably better than what the Japanese did in WWII. Next is Midway and then on to Hawaii.

Stop them now or they may be on the west coast before long.

That is certainly one eventual concern. Perhaps an even more immediate one is China's ongoing move to secure land and vital resources throughout Africa and elsewhere. If China is able to gain a stranglehold on the raw materials necessary to produce current technology then military conquest becomes almost superfluous.

 

[Ark]

It's not really even about Taiwan. Taiwan is merely the first step for China, not the endgame. China must expand or it will collapse, Taiwan will just be the trial run of that expansion. Sooner or later China will have to be stopped, either economically or militarily, and the more that is ceded to them in attempts at appeasement the more difficult stopping them will be.

This is the big picture issue. Maybe we can appease our way to peace and comfort for the rest of our own lives, but not our children's lives. The bottom line is China has a billion and a half people all clamoring for a Western standard of living with Western consumption habits and Western resource demands and the only way that beast gets fed is by expansion and conquest. This WILL happen and China will gobble up the world one country at a time until somebody stops them. If we blow off doing it now and sacrifice Taiwan like Hong Kong was sacrificed, they'll be all the stronger when the time does come.

 

[jake blue]

That is certainly one eventual concern. Perhaps an even more immediate one is China's ongoing move to secure land and vital resources throughout Africa and elsewhere. If China is able to gain a stranglehold on the raw materials necessary to produce current technology then military conquest becomes almost superfluous.

This is mostly what it's all about. China was hot on our heels as we exited (abandoned) Afghanistan with a deal worth billions to secure that country's natural resources. I'm sure the same goes for Africa but I've not researched that deal much. Taiwan isn't necessarily a resource land-grab as much as it is a high-tech manufacturing hostile takeover. So what you have is a nation securing both the raw materials necessary and the existing manufacturing infrastructure capable of producing what? Mostly microchips and lithium batteries, the building blocks of the 21st century. And no doubt once they control the market for these intermediate goods, the rest of the world will be easy pickings. Plus the added benefit that a Taiwan-under-Chinese-rule will be required to embed all that stealthy Chinese spyware into every microchip manufactured to ensure they have their insidious digital tendrils inside every smart device in every country on the planet. They don't have to fight wars if they already have all the dirt on us and can control whether we get to continue to participate in modern society or get cut off from being able to conduct even the most basic life transactions when our technology is used against us. And where would they have gotten such a diabolical plan like that?!?

 

[Leadeye]

What is to stop then from taking over all the south Pacific islands? They would be well fortified probably better than what the Japanese did in WWII. Next is Midway and then on to Hawaii.

Stop them now or they may be on the west coast before long.

I wonder how much of the coast they already own. Maybe they just see this as filling in the spaces between. Leadership will sell them whatever they want, because in the end, it's all about the Benjamins.

 

[BugI02]

I see nobody wanted to touch this. We've legally recognized China as the government of Taiwan, as has most of the world with the "One China Policy". Now you're getting stirred up over internal propaganda for China and think we're really going to land troops? Under any administration? Why the eff would we do that?

We just left Afghanistan, somebody else's civil war were we didn't really understand the culture and didn't really have a game plan. You guys think Taiwan is monolithic and against reunification? You think fighting a near peer on their home turf is going to go as "smoothly" as Afghanistan did? That mission creep won't set in? That we'll just beat the Chinese back and go home? Somebody tell me what's our national interest in interfering in Taiwan that makes the inevitable loss of men and material worth it? Not emotional chest beating because they said something mean, what's our logical need to get involved with this?

Chip production, we no longer do it

My preferred solution would be have TSMC and the others open manufactories here

Barring that, my second favorite solution is nuke the **** out of them

 

[BugI02]

If the US government can't be counted on to fight wars on behalf of big business interests, what in the world can be relied on?

That progs will continue to believe every supposed problem can be solved with other peoples money?

 

[BugI02]

What is there to touch exactly? In the short term you're correct in the rationalization that'll likely be used in support of such appeasement. Long term, it seems likely that Taiwan is the current Sudetenland and the Biden administration is likely to play the role of a dumber, less honorable Neville Chamberlain. As you said, the loss of men and material is inevitable, appeasement doesn't change that inevitability, it only increases the cost.

Well said

Of course nobody really wants a war, but the only way to guarantee that is to roll over and likely keep rolling over

 

[BugI02]

Why we would suddenly shift gears and deploy the military for an independant Taiwan when our policy for years as been:

This is the big picture issue. Maybe we can appease our way to peace and comfort for the rest of our own lives, but not our children's lives. The bottom line is China has a billion and a half people all clamoring for a Western standard of living with Western consumption habits and Western resource demands and the only way that beast gets fed is by expansion and conquest. This WILL happen and China will gobble up the world one country at a time until somebody stops them. If we blow off doing it now and sacrifice Taiwan like Hong Kong was sacrificed, they'll be all the stronger when the time does come.

Agreed, and down that road we become Russia - a weak country clinging to the vestiges of a strong military

Military power is second to economic power. It wasn't our existing military power that let us defeat the axis powers

 

[Jaybird1980]

Why we would suddenly shift gears and deploy the military for an independant Taiwan when our policy for years as been:

U.S. Relations With Taiwan - United States Department of State

U.S.-Taiwan Relationship As a leading democracy and a technological powerhouse, Taiwan is a key U.S. partner in the Indo-Pacific. Though the United States does not have diplomatic relations with Taiwan, we have a robust unofficial relationship. The United States and Taiwan share similar values...

www.state.gov

"The United States does not support Taiwan independence."

Date: 2018.

Trump's State Dept didn't see us going to war for Taiwan independence either, apparently. That's not as much fun as blaming Biden for everything or bumperstickering some of you voted for this, though, so it's ignored.

I don't see how losses would somehow be higher later, nor some inevitable shooting conflict. The Chinese are patient, one of the 'advantages' of an actual totalitarian regime is they can afford to be since they don't have to swing with popular opinion every 4 2/4/6 years. They are not all powerful, however, nor without internal dissent, which is the point of this propaganda. It's not aimed at the American consumer of outrage, we would assume soldiers would be treated as enemy combatants. It's aimed internally to show a lack of fear of the US and project power, which may or may not be real. China's one child policy has not been kind to their military capabilities. Combined with increased standards of living and human life isn't as cheap as it used to be for the rank and file.

Someone should probably explain it to Biden. He is the one that said we would support them.

And then add the Taiwan Relations Act in the mix. Why do you suppose we are selling them the weapons. I guess we should be watching for a bunch of boycotts and embargoes.

Taiwan Relations Act (Public Law 96-8, 22 U.S.C. 3301 et seq.)

Taiwan Relations Act January 1, 1979 TAIWAN RELATIONS ACT PUBLIC LAW 96-8 96TH CONGRESS An Act To help maintain peace, security, and stability in the

www.ait.org.tw

I'm not even saying we should come to rescue them. I'm saying that making statements about supporting them and then backing down when the threats come makes us even weaker, if that's at all possible.

 

[actaeon277]

Chip production, we no longer do it

My preferred solution would be have TSMC and the others open manufactories here

Barring that, my second favorite solution is nuke the **** out of them

We have chip production here.

It is just smaller scale.
Prototyping, and small scale runs.
If you need 100 chips made, China won't shut their line down for such a small amount.
Buy Indy has a small plant.

 

[actaeon277]

Weak leaders embolden those who would cause problems.
Always have.
Always will.

Most wars are started when someone thinks they'll win.

 

[AtTheMurph]

It's not really even about Taiwan. Taiwan is merely the first step for China, not the endgame. China must expand or it will collapse, Taiwan will just be the trial run of that expansion. Sooner or later China will have to be stopped, either economically or militarily, and the more that is ceded to them in attempts at appeasement the more difficult stopping them will be.

Why does China have to expand? They have 1.4b people and a large part of them are still living in abject poverty. All of their growth can be organic for a very long time.

 

[ljk]

Last I read, the man doing the shooting now lives in california

Lived in NoVa/DC area before died of cancer.

IMHO, the execution was justified, although politicians don't agree.

Nguyễn Ngọc Loan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[miguel]

Next is Midway and then on to Hawaii.

Stop them now or they may be on the west coast before long.

Hey, we'd have eight less Democratic Senators then!

 

[1gunaholic]

China Vows To Open Fire on US Troops That Come to Taiwan's Aid

China's military "will heavily attack U.S. troops who come to Taiwan's rescue" if a war between China and Taiwan breaks out, a possibility that is increasingly likely as the Communist regime readies its war machine on Taiwan's borders.

freebeacon.com

China's military "will heavily attack U.S. troops who come to Taiwan's rescue" if a war between China and Taiwan breaks out, a possibility that is increasingly likely as the Communist regime readies its war machine on Taiwan's borders.

The latest threat to attack the United States during any standoff between China and Taiwan was issued Thursday in the Global Times, an official Chinese Communist Party mouthpiece that prints the regime's propaganda. "It is credible that the [People's Liberation Army] will heavily attack U.S. troops who come to Taiwan's rescue," the paper wrote. "Such credibility is increasingly overwhelming the deterrence that U.S. troops may have."


So do you think China would really risk war with the country that does the most business with it?

Or will Democrat leaders allow our troops to be killed and just Sabre rattle to try and appease the American people?

You’re forgetting who is in the White House. Brandon will totally screw this up. Lord help us

 

[KellyinAvon]

Lived in NoVa/DC area before died of cancer.

IMHO, the execution was justified, although politicians don't agree.

Nguyễn Ngọc Loan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Plaid shirt guy was an illegal combatant who murdered the wife and six children of an ARVN Colonel. Within the rules of engagement.