Cleveland 12 yr old with toy gun shot in park

[TontoKowalski]

Police radio recording leading up to and after the incident.
LISTEN | Police radio from Tamir Rice shooting

 

[Yup!]

The officer identified the handgun rather quickly. Seems to me if the kid wasn't in the process of drawing the gun would have gone to the ground with him rather than out to the side where the other officer was able to kick it away.

so perhaps as the kid was reaching he did have his hand on jt, and he did start to draw until he was shot and the weapon then fell from his hands...

 

[gundoc111]

Any more parents need to STRESS to their kids the dangers of a toy gun. 20-30 years ago it was no big deal, now it is. A friend has a little boy, 8-10 who has a air soft gun. He was riding in the back seat of his mom's mini van and smiling, pointed the gun at a car they passed. When they got home the Hamilton County Sheriffs had 4-5 cars waiting at their house. My friends wife had no idea what it was about but when questioned his son admitted it.

The days when we always had our BB guns with us are long gone. Back then kids didn't shoot LEO's and LEO's were not always on condition red.

 

[Ntake]

More Mayberry and less Fallujah, tragic and senseless. There were no shots fired no one in danger, they rolled in hot and heavy with the force of action of a SWAT or SEAL team. They gave themselves no time to assess the situation; their primary job is keepers of the peace. Instead they needlessly escalated the encounter.

 

[Yup!]

More Mayberry and less Fallujah, tragic and senseless. There were no shots fired no one in danger, they rolled in hot and heavy with the force of action of a SWAT or SEAL team. They gave themselves no time to assess the situation; their primary job is keepers of the peace. Instead they needlessly escalated the encounter.

They had to have spotted him before they just drove into the grass like that.

 

[stephen87]

More Mayberry and less Fallujah, tragic and senseless. There were no shots fired no one in danger, they rolled in hot and heavy with the force of action of a SWAT or SEAL team. They gave themselves no time to assess the situation; their primary job is keepers of the peace. Instead they needlessly escalated the encounter.

So you think the officer just pulled up on scene and shot the kid?

Two things really struck me from watching the video. Not condemning the kid or the officer, but just two observations.

1)The officers pulled up and it looked as though the kid began to lift his shirt when they pulled up on him. Could he have been trying to draw the toy? Could he have been saying "it's not real" as he pulled his shirt up? Could he have been trying to raise his hands and got a finger snagged and went to free his hand? I don't know, I don't think anyone will ever know, due to the tragedy of him losing his life. Whatever it was that he was doing cost him the ultimate price.

2) The officers pulled up and it looked as though the officer in the passenger seat was quick on the trigger. Could they have been giving commands off camera? Could they have seen the kid lift his shirt and assumed he was going for the gun? How long had they been in contact with him prior to coming on camera? Did they have eyes on him actually pointing it? Only these officers could answer these questions for us. Unfortunately, these officers have to live with the decision to pull the trigger. However, with such little information provided to them and by the looks of the toy, I would say this could go either way. That toy looks real though.


With that said, someone was having a discussion (a very heated and racist discussion) about this incident the other day on Facebook. A younger liberal suggested the officer should shoot the gun out of the boy's hand and then let him go with a warning due to it being a toy. I laughed and rolled my eyes.

 

[Denny347]

More Mayberry and less Fallujah, tragic and senseless. There were no shots fired no one in danger, they rolled in hot and heavy with the force of action of a SWAT or SEAL team. They gave themselves no time to assess the situation; their primary job is keepers of the peace. Instead they needlessly escalated the encounter.

Go away, 4 years and THIS is your first post?

 

[femurphy77]

Go away, 4 years and THIS is your first post?

 

[Yup!]

At this rate, he will post in the classifieds in 2214..

 

[sonovasailor]

A link to WRTV 6 News. Notice the INGO sticker in the background.
Experts warn against kids using pellet guns - TheIndyChannel.com

 

[Darral27]

My take on this with such a young kid, I would rather be shot and killed by a kid than have to live with shooting and killing a kid. I'm not talking about a 15 yo thug, but a 12yo playing in the park, c'mon. IMO this should not have happened.

 

[JMoses]

My take on this with such a young kid, I would rather be shot and killed by a kid than have to live with shooting and killing a kid. I'm not talking about a 15 yo thug, but a 12yo playing in the park, c'mon. IMO this should not have happened.

Mmmmmkay!??

 

[Darral27]

Mmmmmkay!??

You put a couple of question marks yet I see no question. You have over 50 posts so your not in a rush for the classifieds. Not real sure what your point is.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

My take on this with such a young kid, I would rather be shot and killed by a kid than have to live with shooting and killing a kid. I'm not talking about a 15 yo thug, but a 12yo playing in the park, c'mon. IMO this should not have happened.

Well good thing for you the necessity of taking a life to save your own or someone else's will never happen. So you can continue to armchair quarterback and pass judgement on others.

 

[Denny347]

My take on this with such a young kid, I would rather be shot and killed by a kid than have to live with shooting and killing a kid. I'm not talking about a 15 yo thug, but a 12yo playing in the park, c'mon. IMO this should not have happened.

What about a 20yr old? That is what they though he was. It is easy to judge. Everyone is a use of force and tactics expert. I'm glad your 20/20 hindsight vision is better than mine. Thankfully the USSC is smarter than that in their Graham v. Connor decision that our use of force is based on.

 

[Darral27]

What about a 20yr old? That is what they though he was. It is easy to judge. Everyone is a use of force and tactics expert. I'm glad your 20/20 hindsight vision is better than mine. Thankfully the USSC is smarter than that in their Graham v. Connor decision that our use of force is based on.

I am not judging anybody nor am I "force and tactics expert". The photo's of this child appear to be photo's of a child. I have children myself, one is a 12yo son. I do not believe for a second that when they saw this kid that they thought he was 20, that is just insane. All I said is I would rather be killed myself than to take the life of a young child. If you do not feel the same way Denny I am glad you are not an officer in my town because my 5yo likes toy guns.

 

[Frank_N_Stein]

I am not judging anybody nor am I "force and tactics expert". The photo's of this child appear to be photo's of a child. I have children myself, one is a 12yo son. I do not believe for a second that when they saw this kid that they thought he was 20, that is just insane. All I said is I would rather be killed myself than to take the life of a young child. If you do not feel the same way Denny I am glad you are not an officer in my town because my 5yo likes toy guns.

Do you let your 5 year old point them at strangers and/or the police?

 

[Darral27]

Well good thing for you the necessity of taking a life to save your own or someone else's will never happen. So you can continue to armchair quarterback and pass judgement on others.

You officers are so judgmental. Again I simply saying my opinion. Did us silly citizens lose that right and I have just not been made aware. Glad to know all you cops are so gung-ho about shooting kids. Also glad I don't go to Indy much.

 

[Yup!]

 

[Darral27]

Do you let your 5 year old point them at strangers and/or the police?

He plays outside with them, yes. Some of them are nerf dart guns that are made to point at people much like air soft guns are, so yes. His babysitters husband is a police officer and they play so once again yes.
This was a kid at a park. Not some gangsta on a street corner.