VUPDblue
Silencers Have NEVER Been Illegal !
I feel the need to explain a few things in order to preserve my sanity.
First off, I have been looking forward to INGO lowers coming to fruition since about 2009 when it was first talked about. The ride has been like a roller coaster over the years trying to get this done, with insurmountable obstacles, greedy "middle men" and just plain ol' *******s getting in the way.
Since I have been an INGOer, I have put together 5 group buys for AR lowers and one for Mosin Nagant rifles. None were without their hiccups, but they all were successful in the end. My point is that I have a small amount of experience with these things, which is why I volunteered to tackle the current INGO Lower group buy.
We posted a "feeler" thread with a poll, trying to gauge interest in a lower receiver group buy. The thread was not binding whatsoever. When opening up the official group buy thread, I chose to put a limit on it because of several reasons, the biggest ones being that I have never worked with BCI before and I didn't want to be holding potentially 30k to 40k of INGOers' money and have this turn into a fustercluck. 100 lowers, which is a little under ten grand, seemed to me to be a manageable amount while still getting as many people the opportunity to participate in this go-round as I can.
I chose one single FFL to handle this project for a couple reasons. One, and most importantly, because it is the closest FFL to me physically. I will need to make more than 1 trip to the shop when the product starts rolling in and I simply don't want to have to go all over the place. It's my responsibility and I will make it easier in the areas I can control. Also, I have known Kimball for many years and I trust him, and his shop is somewhat centrally located and easy to get to right off a major highway.
A big issue seems to have been picking out special serial numbers. The logistics of that is difficult at best because I want to guarantee sequential numbers to whomever buys multiples. Also, if any are kicked out as blems during manufacturing, that throws a potential wrench into whomever I promised a certain number to and could screw up the remaining stock for sequential numbers.
There have been many upset members asking why weren't site supporters given first shot or why weren't those who posted in the "feeler" thread given first shot. Again, time, effort and logistics. It simply takes too much time for me to PM everyone who posted in the feeler, and even if I did do that, the folks who have been long time members here and didn't post would have been upset. Then I'd have to wait for every single person's reply before this could go forward. Also, not everyone who voted in the poll posted in the thread. It would have been impossible to personally get with everyone from that thread to determine YES or NO to every single person. It's a no-win situation.
Lots are upset about the payment arrangement. Here's why it is like it is. I have no way to collect credit cards. PayPal is anti-gun and could potentially shut us down in a heartbeat, holding everyone's funds hostage for 6 to 9 months. Square would have been the same. I could have set up a traditional merchant processor, but then there would be added cost to the members in the form of fees. Also, I don't want the exposure of maintaining a CC account for no other reason than to do these group buys. It's not hard to get a PMO and drop it in the mailbox, plus I can keep better records of everyone's info and order. It is more work on my end as well because I have to get all the $ transferred into one fund before I can send it to BCI to get the ball rolling.
I feel like I was very up-front with the rules and guidelines for this project, and at no time was my intent to not include anyone. Quite the opposite in fact, I have done my best to get this initial round going forward so that future rounds will go faster and smoother. Of all the complaints I have gotten, the bottom line for all of them seems to be "you didn't include ME". I'm sorry if you did not get in on this initial order, but by no means are we finished. I'm working on finding FFL partners in the extreme North and extreme South of the state so that more members can be included. I am also working on getting another centralized order going.
At no point have I asked for or accepted any compensation for organizing this. At no point has RobbyMaq asked for or accepted any compensation for creating the artwork for this. We are doing it because the membership asked for it and we want to help.
All the complaining makes going forward seem less and less desirable, so I wanted to put some kind of explanation out there to hopefully clear up why things are happening the way they are. I never dreamed that going forward with this project would have created the **** storm that it has.
First off, I have been looking forward to INGO lowers coming to fruition since about 2009 when it was first talked about. The ride has been like a roller coaster over the years trying to get this done, with insurmountable obstacles, greedy "middle men" and just plain ol' *******s getting in the way.
Since I have been an INGOer, I have put together 5 group buys for AR lowers and one for Mosin Nagant rifles. None were without their hiccups, but they all were successful in the end. My point is that I have a small amount of experience with these things, which is why I volunteered to tackle the current INGO Lower group buy.
We posted a "feeler" thread with a poll, trying to gauge interest in a lower receiver group buy. The thread was not binding whatsoever. When opening up the official group buy thread, I chose to put a limit on it because of several reasons, the biggest ones being that I have never worked with BCI before and I didn't want to be holding potentially 30k to 40k of INGOers' money and have this turn into a fustercluck. 100 lowers, which is a little under ten grand, seemed to me to be a manageable amount while still getting as many people the opportunity to participate in this go-round as I can.
I chose one single FFL to handle this project for a couple reasons. One, and most importantly, because it is the closest FFL to me physically. I will need to make more than 1 trip to the shop when the product starts rolling in and I simply don't want to have to go all over the place. It's my responsibility and I will make it easier in the areas I can control. Also, I have known Kimball for many years and I trust him, and his shop is somewhat centrally located and easy to get to right off a major highway.
A big issue seems to have been picking out special serial numbers. The logistics of that is difficult at best because I want to guarantee sequential numbers to whomever buys multiples. Also, if any are kicked out as blems during manufacturing, that throws a potential wrench into whomever I promised a certain number to and could screw up the remaining stock for sequential numbers.
There have been many upset members asking why weren't site supporters given first shot or why weren't those who posted in the "feeler" thread given first shot. Again, time, effort and logistics. It simply takes too much time for me to PM everyone who posted in the feeler, and even if I did do that, the folks who have been long time members here and didn't post would have been upset. Then I'd have to wait for every single person's reply before this could go forward. Also, not everyone who voted in the poll posted in the thread. It would have been impossible to personally get with everyone from that thread to determine YES or NO to every single person. It's a no-win situation.
Lots are upset about the payment arrangement. Here's why it is like it is. I have no way to collect credit cards. PayPal is anti-gun and could potentially shut us down in a heartbeat, holding everyone's funds hostage for 6 to 9 months. Square would have been the same. I could have set up a traditional merchant processor, but then there would be added cost to the members in the form of fees. Also, I don't want the exposure of maintaining a CC account for no other reason than to do these group buys. It's not hard to get a PMO and drop it in the mailbox, plus I can keep better records of everyone's info and order. It is more work on my end as well because I have to get all the $ transferred into one fund before I can send it to BCI to get the ball rolling.
I feel like I was very up-front with the rules and guidelines for this project, and at no time was my intent to not include anyone. Quite the opposite in fact, I have done my best to get this initial round going forward so that future rounds will go faster and smoother. Of all the complaints I have gotten, the bottom line for all of them seems to be "you didn't include ME". I'm sorry if you did not get in on this initial order, but by no means are we finished. I'm working on finding FFL partners in the extreme North and extreme South of the state so that more members can be included. I am also working on getting another centralized order going.
At no point have I asked for or accepted any compensation for organizing this. At no point has RobbyMaq asked for or accepted any compensation for creating the artwork for this. We are doing it because the membership asked for it and we want to help.
All the complaining makes going forward seem less and less desirable, so I wanted to put some kind of explanation out there to hopefully clear up why things are happening the way they are. I never dreamed that going forward with this project would have created the **** storm that it has.
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I would like to have one as well, I didn't know that it was happening until your doodie shower came along. I appreciate that you put the effort into doing this and hopefully (if you decide to continue) that the next one(s) go much smoother.
That's what I'm doing, no butthurt necessary.
