Taking Main Battle Rifle with GHB?

[avboiler11]

Because hey...it could happen.

 

[bwframe]

...Please explain to me how you plan to prevent Columbine and the Boston bombing with a rifle that gets left in your car?

When the bomb blows up, are you going to run back to your car, retrieve the rifle, and start shooting? Are you going to start detaining people that look suspicious to you? Both great ways to get yourself shot or arrested by the real police.

When someone else starts shooting inside the school, are you going to run out to your car and get your rifle, then run back into the school and start shooting?

If it's not already on you, it's not going to help you. You have real life things to do in the meantime, so it had to be concealed.

You can think up your own little scenarios all day long where bringing out your rifle may not fit your needs appropriately.

What you can't do is think up a rifle when you didn't bring it.

 

[ChalupaCabras]

... i didn't "think up" those scenarios. You proponents did.

I'm asking you how you think a rifle in the car would have helped in ANY of the past events that keep being posted as reasons the OP should keep one.

You proponents keep avoiding the question. The poster above just attacked me instead of answering... what's next?

 

[jblomenberg16]

Wow... yes, i thought it was obvious the discussion was not about hunting, because this discussion is about GHBs, not squirrels.

Others - Please explain to me how you plan to prevent Columbine and the Boston bombing with a rifle that gets left in your car?

When the bomb blows up, are you going to run back to your car, retrieve the rifle, and start shooting? Are you going to start detaining people that look suspicious to you? Both great ways to get yourself shot or arrested by the real police.

When someone else starts shooting inside the school, are you going to run out to your car and get your rifle, then run back into the school and start shooting? Sounds like a great way to get mistaken for the shooter.

If it's not already on you, it's not going to help you. You have real life things to do in the meantime, so it had to be concealed.

Well...there was that issue in Oklahoma last week where a guy ran to his car, got an AR-15 and ended a workplace violence situation. There are varying reports about circumstances, but one of the leading accounts is that he retrieved an AR-15 rifle from the trunk of his car and confronted the shooter and stopped the threat.

Police: FBI probing past of Okla. beheading suspect - CNN.com

 

[avboiler11]

Link to a source stating the Moore, OK executive-come-reserve LEO that shot the beheader with an AR15, please...I have not read any reports mentioning that. If the weapon of choice is accurate, perhaps there's a reason it hasn't been reported...

While there's absolutely nothing wrong with retrieving a firearm from your vehicle (even a carbine) to stop a workplace or school shooting...that is a FAR cry from the "MAJOR SHTF(emp, nuke attack, random terrorist cell uprisings)" that the original poster, a traveling salesman, was discussing as an obstacle to him getting home.

 

[jblomenberg16]

Link to a source stating the Moore, OK executive-come-reserve LEO that shot the beheader with an AR15, please...I have not read any reports mentioning that. If the weapon of choice is accurate, perhaps there's a reason it hasn't been reported...

While there's absolutely nothing wrong with retrieving a firearm from your vehicle (even a carbine) to stop a workplace or school shooting...that is a FAR cry from the "MAJOR SHTF(emp, nuke attack, random terrorist cell uprisings)" that the original poster, a traveling salesman, was discussing as an obstacle to him getting home.

There are no current links to any reliable sources (of course numerous gun forums with conjecture but no confirmation) to confirm what kind of gun it was, hence why I said one of the leading accounts is that it was an AR-15. There are reports of him retrieving a rifle from his car, and that has led a number to suspect it was an AR-15 since he was a reserve officer. Personally it doesn't matter what it was...but is a case where being prepared for a pretty serious situation (definitely a local SHTF situation at that facility) resulted in stopping the threat.

I agree...not the same as a major wide spread catastrophe is what the OP was talking about. My response was to Chalupacabra regarding using a personal rifle to stop an attack.

Slight tangent...it is interesting how conspicuously absent all media reports are about the gun he used to stop the threat, yet they have already confirmed that the knife used in the attack was the same type as used in the meat processing plant. Given the media's obviously anti gun slant, and how quick they are to point out when a bad guys uses and "assault rifle" in a crime, and now how silent they are on this one, that it entirely plausible it was an AR-15 or other similar type of rifle.

 

[indiucky]

IMHO a single shot shotgun with the barrel cut down to a managable level (20")in 12 or 20 gauge with a mix of slugs, buck, and number 6 should always be behind the seat of a pick up truck...I have switched between a .410 snake charmer and a NEF Survivor in 45LC/410 and one or the other is always there...If you want more rounds you can always get a youth model 870 Express and it would take up the same amount of space...

[video=youtube;5keKy6i37J0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5keKy6i37J0[/video]

The key is you would be leaving a $125 gun behind the seat rather than a $1000 gun and still be allowing yourself a little peace of mind in the evnt of whatever event you are concerned about.....

IMHO ofcourse....

 

[CathyInBlue]

Wow... yes, i thought it was obvious the discussion was not about hunting, because this discussion is about GHBs, not squirrels.

Others - Please explain to me how you plan to prevent Columbine and the Boston bombing with a rifle that gets left in your car?

When the bomb blows up, are you going to run back to your car, retrieve the rifle, and start shooting? Are you going to start detaining people that look suspicious to you? Both great ways to get yourself shot or arrested by the real police.

When someone else starts shooting inside the school, are you going to run out to your car and get your rifle, then run back into the school and start shooting? Sounds like a great way to get mistaken for the shooter.

If it's not already on you, it's not going to help you. You have real life things to do in the meantime, so it had to be concealed.

Okay, how about you explain how a Get Home Bag would help in any of those scenarios either. How about an emergency scenario in which having a GHB would help someone get out of trouble or avoid trouble, but having a rifle to hand would not?

The point of a GHB in a Columbine scenario would be to get your own ass out of the school, off the property, and on the way down the road, away from danger. The point of a GHB in a Columbine scenario would not be to armour up and dive into the fray yourself.

The point of a GHB in a Boston Marathon Bombing scenario would be to get your own ass out of the city, away from the things going boom, and on the way down the road, away from danger. The point of a GHB in a Boston Marathon Bombing scenario would not be to armour up and dive into the fray to pursue and arrest suspected bombers.

@ Indiucky: Funny you you should mention .45LC-.410 guns. Terre Haute Guns Firearms in Terre Haute | Buy, Sell and Trade Guns | Firearm Transfers has a Rossi Circuit Judge 5-shot revolver carbine in the offing right now. Looks like just the kind of gun to hide in a side pocket of a vehicle. At least, after a new under-folding buttstock is fabricated for it. It's more in the $600 range than the $150 range, but you get 5 shots, no waiting.

 

[Justus]

I have to run some errands today there's about a 100 million-to-one chance I will have to ditch my car and fight my way home, should I take the AR or the FAL?

 

[jblomenberg16]

I have to run some errands today there's about a 100 million-to-one chance I will have to ditch my car and fight my way home, should I take the AR or the FAL?

Obviously both.

 

[bwframe]

IMHO a single shot shotgun with the barrel cut down to a managable level (20")in 12 or 20 gauge with a mix of slugs, buck, and number 6 should always be behind the seat of a pick up truck...I have switched between a .410 snake charmer and a NEF Survivor in 45LC/410 and one or the other is always there...If you want more rounds you can always get a youth model 870 Express and it would take up the same amount of space...

[video=youtube;5keKy6i37J0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5keKy6i37J0[/video]


The key is you would be leaving a $125 gun behind the seat rather than a $1000 gun and still be allowing yourself a little peace of mind in the evnt of whatever event you are concerned about.....

IMHO ofcourse....

That is a way cool vid. I'm a believer in the survival 12 gauge and that guy runs it well. That said, if they live past the first shot, nearly anyone with any modern service rifle beats that guy. If shotgun guy has to deal with more than one rifleman, his chances are practically nil. I'd certainly take the short scattergun (especially my coach gun,) over just a handgun. Realistically though, an AR is the only way to go.

IMHO, your threats beyond every day life's will be others with long guns. You do your best to avoid confrontations, but if you are in it, you are in it.

Am I worried about theft or having to leave my expensive rifle somewhere? Meh, I have insurance for that. Don't you?
What the heck do you have a fighting rifle for if you're not gonna bring it out to fight? It's a tool, learn to use it and use it like one.

 

[jbrooks19]

I have to run some errands today there's about a 100 million-to-one chance I will have to ditch my car and fight my way home, should I take the AR or the FAL?

Iv'e been watching and reading this thread for a couple days now.

Justus,
If you have nothing constructive to say then why even chime in? Trying to run up your post count so people think your cool?

To the OP: IMO, a shotgun would be best. I ALWAYS have one in my trunk or toolbox if in the truck. You can get a Stevens 320 pump for $175~ and it is reliable. Shotguns are the most versatile weapon IMO. If you have to ditch your vehicle for whatever reason, then decide if you should leave it locked or take it with you. And, if you want to blend in more, then buy a Remmy 870 in wood. People would look at that in a less intimidating way in which case would not cause alarm.

 

[Justus]

Iv'e been watching and reading this thread for a couple days now.

Justus,
If you have nothing constructive to say then why even chime in? Trying to run up your post count so people think your cool?

Ha, yep you caught me. I was just trying to look cool.

 

[Cpt Caveman]

Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for awhile now. Im one of those guys who will work up to 150ish miles away from home making deliveries, marketing, and doing sales. I often contemplate if I should take my S&W MP15t with me while on the road. This is my SHTF rifle, and is my best shooter. It has a sling, red dot, and magpul flip up sights. Its set up to be carried with the single point sling.

So basically my question is should I carry this on my longer trips where if some MAJOR SHTF happened (emp, nuke attack, random terrorist cell uprisings)? I realize these are the worst scenarios, but are the ones that I'm unsure of because I might not be able to drive back home.

Short answer is yes if it makes you feel more prepared to get yourself home to your family. Another way to assuage the uneasiness caused by the thought of not being able to return home quickly is to make sure folks at home know how to use a firearm in their own self defense. Then they could defend themselves if you were making your way home on foot.

Arguing its a bad idea is just kinda odd. Its a personal choice and if it makes you feel better then do it. If you need a firearm a rifle is gonna take care of all situations, short medium or long range.

 

[ChalupaCabras]

Okay, how about you explain how a Get Home Bag would help in any of those scenarios either. How about an emergency scenario in which having a GHB would help someone get out of trouble or avoid trouble, but having a rifle to hand would not?

I'm not really sure what your argument with me is ... You answered your own questions. :/

The point of the GHB is to get home, and away from the disaster, as you said. The objective is NOT to engage or participate in the mayhem, as you said.

I'm not advocating for a rifle, I'm advocating for something smaller that the OP could idealy keep, in day to day life, on his person or accessable under a car seat - so that he can get back to his vehicle, defend that vehicle, and get his butt back home.

I have never, and I am not saying, that someone will NEVER be able to retrieve a rifle from their car. Its frankly illogical for you to accuse me of that, because it doesn't prove your point either. Its just another straw man to distract from the real issue... The real issue is that you need to have something accessable to you or it will be very difficult to deploy that weapon or equipment (that is to say, you need to have it on your person or within arms reach).

You can not practically carry a rifle with you on your person in professional life. You CAN keep a breifcase or a satchel, or a small backpack. All of the armament and SHTF supplies in the world do you no good if you dont have them when you need them. Something that you can keep in your small bag along with your buisness related material is what I'm advocating for the OP - so he can continue to live a normal life, but have some kind of meaningfull insurance for an emergency.

ALSO - for the poster with the story about the AR15 being used to stop the islamic terror attack in Oklahoma, please do find the link. That is great news if we can verify that.

 

[rhino]

I carry a lot of stuff I probably won't need, but if I do need it, there won't be any substitutes.

The argument against carrying a rifle based on "you probably won't need it" could easily be made for a handgun as well. If you base all of your risk analysis solely on the likelihood of an incident, carrying any kind of firearm would be a poor choice for all us. However, that's a shallow dip into risk analysis since a prudent individual will consider not only the probability of a given event, but also the magnitude of the potential consequences for various choices.

I probably won't need a fire extinguisher because I probably won't have a fire.

 

[bwframe]

I carry a lot of stuff I probably won't need, but if I do need it, there won't be any substitutes.
...
I probably won't need a fire extinguisher because I probably won't have a fire.

Smoke detectors are pretty useless around my house too. Except for that annoying bastard in the kitchen...

I don't think you really need them. We should...

..."try to put practicality ahead of fantasies."

ALSO - for the poster with the story about the AR15 being used to stop the islamic terror attack in Oklahoma, please do find the link. That is great news if we can verify that.

Oklahoma Man Charged With Murder in Beheading - ABC News
The company's chief operating officer, Mark Vaughan, a reserve sheriff's deputy in Oklahoma City, leveled a rifle at Nolen and fired, striking him once and stopping the attack.
What we know about Alton Nolen, who has been charged with murder in the Oklahoma beheading case - The Washington Post
Nolen then attacked 43-year-old Traci Johnson, another employee, before he was stopped by the company’s chief operating officer, Mark Vaughan. Vaughan, a reserve deputy with the Oklahoma County Sheriff’s Department, shot Nolen with a rifle, stopping the attack.

 

[avboiler11]

Thank you for the links stating a rifle was used to stop the attacker in Moore!

 

[6mm Shoot]

It maters little what we think. It is what you think will happen and what you think you will need to get home. I will give you some facts.

If you are 150 miles from home and for what ever reason you have to start walking home it will take you around 15 days to get home. That is if you do 10 miles a day. If I had to make that trip I would be more concerned with food and water.

If you look at all things that could go wrong how often will a gun get you out of trouble? In a storm in the winter say you get snowed in and decide to walk home. What will you need? Good boots, water, food, a place to sleep that is warm and dry.

If an attack is made on the US and it is half way between you and home what will you need to get home? Chances are you will have to go around the place where the attack happened. You sure as hell don't want to go through there with a rifle slung over your shoulder. That would be just asking for trouble.

Now I live in the country and see people with guns every now and then on the road or on there property with them. You don't see people walking around with a rifle slung and on your property. If you do you call the powers that be to get that fool off your property. Trespassing is a crime and trespassing with a firearm is asking for trouble. You are looking at jail time and the loss of your gun if the guy presses charges.

Now we say you are away from home and start waking home for what ever reason. You are making 14 miles a day and every thing is going well. You are eating and drinking and getting good rest at night and into your third day, a police car comes up behind you and pulls over and asks you what you are doing. You explain that you are trying to get home. Now think of all the reasons this guy isn't going to let you go on your way. How many people has he dealt with that have been a problem for his area that were just trying to get home.

Now chances are that what ever happened you will be able to take a buss home or go to a truck stop and bum a ride with a trucker to get you to where you are going. If it was a bad storm, in a day or two you will be good to go. If it is a very bad event that takes out roads and power lines. There will be trucks and other traffic going around the problem. It may be a couple days to get things going but they will be setting things up. Goods have to be moved. No matter what, goods have to be moved.

I understand your concerns for your family, your desire to protect them and be with them. You may want to prep your home for your loved ones to be able to do with out you for a few days and take care of them selves. Teach the wife to shoot. Have enough stuff for them to live off of for a month or two. In today's world you need that anyway.

When I was working I worked out of town now and then for a month at a time. I always knew that there was enough food and other stuff before I headed out of town. We prep, garden so that wasn't the hard part. The hard part was being away from her and home.

Yes I always kept a handgun with me when I worked out of town.

I can't think of an event that would happen that would stop you from getting home after a couple of days. If you are considering a all out war, getting home will be the least of your problems.

 

[jblomenberg16]

Since we're having good debate on this topic...here's a few more hypothetical scenarios that may have a higher probability of taking place.

1) You are involved in a multi-car accident on your way to / from work, and your vehicle is no longer drivable. Prior to loading your vehicle on the tow truck, you ask to remove any valuables and personal items from the vehicle, hence retrieving your GHB and "Trunk Gun." First responders are still on the scene dealing with the accident investigation and clean up. What additional hurdles might you have in getting to your destination?


2) For one reason or another you are pulled over for a normal traffic stop, and in the course of discussion with the officer, he decides he has probable cause to search your vehicle. Either through your consent, or after placing you under arrest for the offense that drove the traffic stop, he searches and finds your GHB, Trunk Gun, and your small stash of ammunition. Lets say that unknown to you, they are searching for a suspect of some armed robberies and other crimes committed with a similar weapon. Are you fully prepared to deal with the likely legal proceedings to confirm your innocence? Does the state you are travelling in make the situation better or worse? Do the "cache" of supplies that you have in your GHB, including ammunition, med kits, and other survival items create further suspicion? Are you prepared for that to be a potential front page story in your local newspaper?