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Why do CZs seem to rule USPSA Production matches?
- Thread starter THE BIG SITT
- Start date
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The CZs/clones do seem nicer the little I've played with them. But I figure if I want to get better results I'm better off taking the $1500 I'd have to spend on the gun + holsters/mags/etc and buying bullets spending more time at the range. But then, I'm always behind the cool-kid curve. I was the only one running a DA gun at most matches for years, then when I FINALLY switch over to the plastic junk (because prices on used 92 Elites were stupid) the rest of the world re-discovers DA guns. Perhaps if I wait long enough this time the pendulum will swing again? 
Nah. The equipment race has been won. Only a rule change will obsolete steel DA guns at this point...
The worst thing we can do for the sport at this point is give the impression that riding the unicorn is required to shoot the division. The reality is unless someone is going for the division win at a major, the gun STILL doesn't matter. You can still win your class w/ a glock just as well as a Tangfo. I'm afraid after years of steady growth the equipment race will ultimately hurt production division just because of perceptions of what you need to participate. production was created to draw people in w/o the perceived need for a "race" gun....
-rvb
Nah. The equipment race has been won. Only a rule change will obsolete steel DA guns at this point...The worst thing we can do for the sport at this point is give the impression that riding the unicorn is required to shoot the division. The reality is unless someone is going for the division win at a major, the gun STILL doesn't matter. You can still win your class w/ a glock just as well as a Tangfo. I'm afraid after years of steady growth the equipment race will ultimately hurt production division just because of perceptions of what you need to participate. production was created to draw people in w/o the perceived need for a "race" gun....
-rvb
Even at a major, it doesn't really matter that much. gutt won a whole bunch of them with a Glock.
Looking at my match results over the past year as compared to some other shooters that are pretty consistent, I didn't really gain a lot going from the G 17 to the unicorn. But the unicorn allows me to do it with less effort and I enjoy shooting it more.
Looking at my match results over the past year as compared to some other shooters that are pretty consistent, I didn't really gain a lot going from the G 17 to the unicorn. But the unicorn allows me to do it with less effort and I enjoy shooting it more.
I'm never leaving my house again.
"He can make diamonds from peer pressure alone."
jakemartens
Master
Just stay on the side walk
Slawburger
Master
I am currently negotiating sponsorship agreements with both Tanfoglio and CZ. They are offering considerable incentives if I agree to not use their firearms, not wear hats or shirts with their logos and in all practical ways distance myself and my scores from their products.
DA/SA alone makes the gun much easier to shoot than a glock. I know I took a step backwards when I swiched to glock. 2 years later I feel I'm finally performing about as well as I was with 92. I don't enjoy the glock as much. so I know where you're coming from. Over-all finishes didn't change a whole lot on average, but I could tell a difference. I think it's largely a confidence thing....
-rvb
I asked this originally because I have been craving an M&P9L Pro to go with my FS and Compact. I don't see myself becoming uber competitive in the next few years, but I don't want to buy a gun only to find I won't even be on the same playing field as others. With this being something I can see myself doing for years (I'm only 23 now), I don't want to become accustomed to something that will limit how I perform, only to have to "relearn" everything if I decide to get the high dollar gun. Sounds like I will make all the difference in how I shoot, not the gun.
riverman67
Master
I'm still waiting on that video, it would be an instant classic
they are the flavor of the month. simple answer but if you look at the history top shooters never stick with any gun for long someone is always coming out with the new next best thing.... and before you naysayers jump in there are always exceptions
IMO the majority of the improvements related to the feel of the gun are based on some deliberate, but not overly complicated, modifications to the internals.
I think its slightly more than "buff and polish" to make the whole package, but WRT why I chose them, which was mainly based on the trigger feel, the CZ lends itself to gaining huge benefits from a little TLC. The basic design of the contact surfaces of the gun allow polishing to have a significant impact on overall pull weight and feel by reducing static and dynamic friction in several contact points through the SA and DA trigger stroke. The fundamental design of a Glock lends itself to unmatched reliability but static and dynamic friction do not play as large a role in the overall feel. Yes, polishing the firing pin block, cruciform, disconector, etc. does have an impact on a Glock, its just not as significant. A pessimist might say that a CZ is built ugly enough that there is huge potential in cleaning it up while the Glock is designed so well that its nearly as good as its ever going to be.
Obviously the Accu Shadow requires some significant and skilled gunsmithing to add the bushing and the Target requires careful milling to add the adjustable rear site but both of those things are preference based and don't affect the primary reason I switched to it.
I ordered my Accu and Target from CZC shop and the triggers that came back with each gun were very different. Not because they were supposed to be but because the work is done by hand and different people apparently have different standards. The contact surfaces on my Target were polished noticeably better then the ones on my Accu. IMO opinion of the feel, and backed up by trigger pull gauging, my less expensive Shadow Target had a better trigger "out of the CZC box" then my more expensive Accu did. I had to re-work most of the surfaces of my Accu to get it to feel as good as my Target. After a few hours of tuning they are both within .25lb on DA and SA and have essentially the same feel. Although technically the Accu has the short reset system, as installed by CZC, and my Target only has a drop in Pre-B disco, polished and tuned by me.
Side note: After switching to a steel frame gun after shooting Glocks and XDs for years I did notice one issue when I went back to my Glocks. I learned to grip the CZ harder than any other gun I shot so when I go back to my Glock I can now notice the frame deform slightly when I really grip down on it. That probably always happened but I just never noticed it until now. Its not a bad thing just something I notice, especially on my Gen 3, G19.
I need a sarcasm flag.
Shoot what you have until you know what you like. Your a MP FS will serve you well while you are learning.
You won't be competitive until you start competing. Shoot what you have until you know what you want.
