Heavily-armed citizen militia group plans to patrol smuggling corridor

[Bushido Devil Dog]

Heavily-armed citizen militia group plans to patrol smuggling area - KOLD News 13

Heavily-armed citizen militia group plans to patrol smuggling corridor

By Teresa Jun
And Christopher Francis

PINAL COUNTY, AZ (KOLD) - A group of citizens plans to arm themselves with heavy weaponry and patrol the Vekol Valley area of Pinal County, looking for drug smugglers entering the country. They plan to conduct their patrol operation from 3:00pm Saturday to 3:00pm Sunday.

"We're going to block off the narcoterrorists that come up through this area," said Mesa resident Jason "J.T." Ready, who is organizing the gathering.

Ready says volunteers are coming from all over Arizona, and even out of state, to support the effort.

"This is the Minuteman Project on steroids," Ready explained. "We've got people with assault weapons.

 

[SavageEagle]

NSM Border Action in AZ June 19th-20th


Will be found on youtube.

Man....

You acted as if there would be blood guts and shoot outs or a bunch of "Heil Hitler!"..... I was actually disappointed! It's just two videos of them showing off their guns, place to stay, putting up three American Flags, finding a dead body that's already nothing but bones (literally) and that they captured ONE guy.

Oh, and the second video is much like the first, but has a guy running around in a Guile Suit.

It didn't even show them patrolling....

These guys were just "stopping for a rest" at a truck stop on I8 and at least spotted 3 who they had arrested.
(Posted June 12, 2010)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_nndWDaW14]YouTube - SDMM Capture Illegal Aliens along Arizona's I8 Smuggling Corridor - full version[/ame]

 

[j706]

Just be prepared when those people you are looking for are either themselves better armed, or the police/army escorting them are better armed, than you were prepared for.

So, if you go down in Molle and slung up with your FAL, be ready for the two following situations:

A) Destitute family with small children who are dehydrated and not going back.
B) Armed gang, or group with army support, that bear down on you with a HUMMV and a M2.

Shoot in (A) and you are a murderer, shoot in (B) and you are likely dead - frankly if you do not shoot in (B) you are likely worse off than dead.

I understand the desire, and pull to try and fill in where our government has failed us. But at the same time, you had better spend some real serious time playing out all the variations of how bad the border is and how you can actually help the situation.

I dunno. But anyone doing this needs to thing REAL HARD first.

I would recomend listening to this mans advice.

 

[IndyMonkey]

I would recomend listening to this mans advice.

There's two kind of people in this world.

The kind that would jump in head first into a burning car to save another person, and the one that hesitates.

 

[irishfan]

I want to know what happens when a well prepared Mexican cartel unit attacks them and then drags them across the border to make them appear to have came to that side. Will the U.S. then have to attempt to make a deal to get them back or will the Mexican government put them in prison to make a point? This has a lot of potential of going wrong and could easily be solved if 50-75,ooo troops are brought back to U.S. and put on the border so it is protected like it should be.

 

[henktermaat]

hunting people is a thousand times more fun than animals. and theyre always in season.

I hope you never go to court for any type of self-defence shooting, because the prosecuting lawyers will dig up this comment...

 

[jeremy]

I hope you never go to court for any type of self-defence shooting, because the prosecuting lawyers will dig up this comment...

Why?! I am already stuck on several levels of suck with a Prosecutor. Something trivial like a statement like that is a minor bump on the radar.

 

[JBusch8899]

.

 

[jeremy]

If one wasn't traumatized to some degree in viewing Berg's murder, then I question that individual's morals and overall mental health, as they would be more akin to a sociopath than any other description I could reasonably attribute. I certainly and sincerely hope that you were at least to some extent, disturbed by the content of this posted video as well.

Can't say that it really traumatized me. Morals, never really had much need for those in my life. Does that make me a Sociopath, maybe, you have to be a little bit of one to do the career path that I have chosen to walk down.

Disturbed me. The part that disturbed me the most was the response from Our populace and Nation. Or I would be more correct in saying the lack of a response by them. Cur animals like those that done such acts should be hunted to the ends of the Earth and removed from the Gene Pool. With extreme prejudice at that!

What it did do was drive home the point that the Romans understood this Two Millennia ago and we have forgotten it since apparently!

 

[ATOMonkey]

I think one guy (the big one) is carrying a .22 conversion.

 

[irishfan]

I have seen videos like the one that was mentioned before and I have to say that it makes me want to nuke the crap out of the middle east. Also, the violence on the border needs to be addressed by the federal government as that is their job and not something that should get so far as to making citizens do it theirself.

 

[E5RANGER375]

Hey guys, want a good reason why we must be more supportive of Az than ever before?


Go to the following link



P.S. Warning. Do not go if you have liberal sensibilities, and dont care to see how nasty the wolves are.

AGAIN, I must say this is extremely graphic, and incredibly brutal.


AND THESE ARE THE PEOPLE OBAMA WILL GRANT AMNESTY TO.


Definitely not a video for the "keyboard commandos" and the peace/love types.

seems like a mod didnt like your link. can you PM it to me?

 

[Tactical Dave]

To answer your question, no. I could not in fact turn off the video, nor leave the room that it was being shown. As an employee of such at the time, I was obligated by the Sheriff to attend and participate in specific and compulsory departmental inservices.

Oh ok, I thought you were saying it tramatized you but it appeared that you watched it by choice.

I never watched it personally.

 

[Whosyer]

So, after the NSM secures the border, do we send in Jake and Elwood?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhozx819izU"]YouTube - The Blues Brothers - Nazis Scene[/ame]

 

[Andyland]

The AZ group had girl guns.
I didn't see much ammo or water.
No kevlar.
No night vision.
The guy in black would be ok at night, with no moon, but is going to roast during the day.
And he would stand out for miles, which is fine if he is the designated target.
I am guessing they had not worked on their cardio.
I would recommend a line of fire bases, camouflaged observation posts, and some serious rapid reaction forces.
And the last thing they need to be doing is shooting video.

 

[techres]

The AZ group had girl guns.
I didn't see much ammo or water.
No kevlar.
No night vision.
The guy in black would be ok at night, with no moon, but is going to roast during the day.
And he would stand out for miles, which is fine if he is the designated target.
I am guessing they had not worked on their cardio.
I would recommend a line of fire bases, camouflaged observation posts, and some serious rapid reaction forces.
And the last thing they need to be doing is shooting video.

Bingo! They have no clue. To be tactically effective they would, by definition, have to act illegally. The rules of engagement are brutal on the military, but at least they have some. Civilians simply can protect themselves from imminent threat.

I would love to see how this squad plans to explain to the court how they setup and ambush and fired from protected, hidden positions all in order to protect themselves from the bad guys they went out to stop.

Conviction.

And if they did not do the following, there's every chance they will simply get rolled or disarmed and killed like blue hats in Rawanda. Having guns ain't the end all be all.

And, again, the most likely case is running across families and potentially kids. Living, breathing, children. What are you gonna do then? Perhaps the battle hardened will not flinch at that - or will have a better method for dealing with that. But my guess is 95% of the posters here have no idea how they will actually deal with crying, hungry, heat sick kids at 4 am in their gun lights.

Finally, if they so much as make a single mistake and kill a civilian, Mexican or American, then again, conviction.

I am just not sure how any of this makes sense other than as a photo-op. Perhaps if they were like the previous border watchers with chairs, binoculars, and a sidearm or discreet longarm I would understand. But these guys ain't that.

So, until we declare war, setup letters of Marque, or otherwise give some legal cover to people - this is all a big, big FAIL.

 

[SavageEagle]

Bingo! They have no clue. To be tactically effective they would, by definition, have to act illegally. The rules of engagement are brutal on the military, but at least they have some. Civilians simply can protect themselves from imminent threat.

I would love to see how this squad plans to explain to the court how they setup and ambush and fired from protected, hidden positions all in order to protect themselves from the bad guys they went out to stop.

Conviction.

And if they did not do the following, there's every chance they will simply get rolled or disarmed and killed like blue hats in Rawanda. Having guns ain't the end all be all.

And, again, the most likely case is running across families and potentially kids. Living, breathing, children. What are you gonna do then? Perhaps the battle hardened will not flinch at that - or will have a better method for dealing with that. But my guess is 95% of the posters here have no idea how they will actually deal with crying, hungry, heat sick kids at 4 am in their gun lights.

Finally, if they so much as make a single mistake and kill a civilian, Mexican or American, then again, conviction.

I am just not sure how any of this makes sense other than as a photo-op. Perhaps if they were like the previous border watchers with chairs, binoculars, and a sidearm or discreet longarm I would understand. But these guys ain't that.

So, until we declare war, setup letters of Marque, or otherwise give some legal cover to people - this is all a big, big FAIL.

You make good points. However, if the act in the same manner as the Border Patrol, things should be just fine. You find a family. Maybe they're carrying drugs, maybe not. Maybe they're armed, maybe not. regardless, MY plan would be to interact with them. (Hoping SOMEONE in the group spoke spanish) Give them water. (3 days without water, 3 weeks without food) They don't need food. Border Patrol will worry about that. Once Border Patrol is called and they come, just give your statement, answer any questions, and move along.

I would be just as heavily armed as these people going to the border, because, as you all said, what happens when you run into a heavily armed group? You set up defensive positions, call Border Patrol, defend yourself until the threat retreats or BP shows up. Retreat when necessary because at least you know the location of the group and the general area.

R.O.E. for us civilians would be the same as any other daily situation. You don't fire unless fired upon. You make sure of your target. You don't fire into a group of innocents.

Protecting life is priority #1. No one should be down there under the premise of wanting to kill anyone. Anyone who SERIOUSLY goes down there wanting to "Kill them all." is a danger to the group and themselves. I understand the feeling of wanting to kill the drug cartel members. Those people wouldn't hesitate to kill you given the chance. But the "Mules" are just that. Mules. Find them, Identify them, verbally engage them to find out their intentions, call Border Patrol, Defend yourself IF NECESSARY. Otherwise, let Border Patrol handle the legalise of it all. All we would have to do is make a citizens arrest and that's as far as our involvement goes.

I'm under no illusions of the situation or my legal allowance in the situation. There's only so much I could do should I go down there.

But I think you're right... Many don't realize that.

 

[techres]

You make good points. However, if the act in the same manner as the Border Patrol, things should be just fine.

Except they have protection under law that you do not have. They are LEO's, you are not.

You find a family. Maybe they're carrying drugs, maybe not. Maybe they're armed, maybe not. regardless, MY plan would be to interact with them. (Hoping SOMEONE in the group spoke spanish) Give them water. (3 days without water, 3 weeks without food) They don't need food. Border Patrol will worry about that. Once Border Patrol is called and they come, just give your statement, answer any questions, and move along.

And when they ignore you and wander on, what do you do? Seriously, what do you do? Detain them? What does that look like?

And when Border Patrol does not answer, or does not come, or thanks you to mind your own business, what then? Keep in mind, many in border patrol have zero interest in help from civilians. Zero, so I would not assume that they will come running at your beck & call.

I would be just as heavily armed as these people going to the border, because, as you all said, what happens when you run into a heavily armed group? You set up defensive positions, call Border Patrol, defend yourself until the threat retreats or BP shows up. Retreat when necessary because at least you know the location of the group and the general area.

If you run into someone (an aggressor), it is too late to set up positions. Ask the National Guardsmen who have been in that exact position who backed off of coyotes better armed, trained, and experienced than they were. Mexicans still alive are now either skilled survivors, skilled fighters, or both. Are you? I doubt anyone here who is non-military is.

R.O.E. for us civilians would be the same as any other daily situation. You don't fire unless fired upon. You make sure of your target. You don't fire into a group of innocents.

Except at 4 am you do not have the time to be sure. Except at 4am you are 5 guys facing off with 10-20 people who may or may not be armed. Except at 4am you cannot see what you are doing. Except at 4am this is suddenly so very much more real than it seemed on INGO. Except at court the decision you made at 4am does not seem to be nearly as rational as it did back then and the jury is looking at you in a way that probably means 4-5 years and never owning a firearm again in your life.

Protecting life is priority #1. No one should be down there under the premise of wanting to kill anyone. Anyone who SERIOUSLY goes down there wanting to "Kill them all." is a danger to the group and themselves. I understand the feeling of wanting to kill the drug cartel members. Those people wouldn't hesitate to kill you given the chance.

Yeah, and they do not wear uniforms, spend time with the internet, or let you know that they plan to kill you before they do. Additionally, they do not care about the law and have seen far more war than any crip or blood in this country.

But the "Mules" are just that. Mules. Find them, Identify them, verbally engage them to find out their intentions, call Border Patrol, Defend yourself IF NECESSARY. Otherwise, let Border Patrol handle the legalise of it all. All we would have to do is make a citizens arrest and that's as far as our involvement goes.

Anyone willing to shove dope up their ass is not going to be intimidated by you or me. Neither are you going to identify them without violating at least 3-8 laws of man and nature. Border patrol may or may not show, and when the mules simply walk past you - what power are you going to use to detain them? What power beyond your glock 19 and sks do you have?

I'm under no illusions of the situation or my legal allowance in the situation. There's only so much I could do should I go down there.

But I think you're right... Many don't realize that.

I think that anyone going down there needs to know EXACTLY what powers they have, and what risks they are taking. They need to be VERY clear about what they are going to face and what they plan to do. They need to be practiced and they need to consider the wisdom of their choice.

And finally, they need to decide if this is real or a lark, because the guys on the other side are as real as it gets.

 

[SavageEagle]

You really expect me to spell out every situation and how I would personally handle it?

I realize that the Border Patrol don't want my help. They've stated that clearly many times to the media and on their own website and signs across the southwest states. Personally, I think they've made deals with the Cartels. Why WOULDN'T they want to know about illegals coming into the Country if they were there doing their job? If they CARED about their job? 1) They DON'T care about their job, or 2) They're scared less from the death threats and/or have taken money. Either from the cartels themselves or hush money from our own Government.

I know full well my authority should I ever choose to go down there. It's not much. I know that. But I do have some authority and would have no issues using it.

And again, I'm not going to discuss specific tactics on how a group of civilians would handle a group of illegals on the border. But I'm not stupid and I don't think it would be a cake walk and I don't think I'm superman and nothing can harm me.

However, if the government's not going to stop it, and regular people like us are too scared to stop it, then why are any of you discussing it at all? Why not just say Eff It and open the border to every Tom Dick and Harry that wants to come here? Why not declare ALL people citizens of the USA and be done with it?

I mean, we're all just keyboard commandos and in reality too scared to really go down there and do something about it, right?

 

[techres]

You really expect me to spell out every situation and how I would personally handle it?

I mean, we're all just keyboard commandos and in reality too scared to really go down there and do something about it, right?

#1. Best that you don't spell it out. Just making sure everyone who considers it think it out, practice it out, and prepare it out before turning the key in the ignition to head south.

#2. I am not concerned about keyboard commandos who are too scared to go. I am concerned about gun owners who are not scared to go and do so without prep, thought, or legal consideration. The keyboard commandos are not a problem, it is the gun owner who gets himself tossed in jail that is a problem.

And to be clear, I fully understand the draw to do something like this. I get the need to do something, anything to fix the border problem. And I know that it is tempting to go and do what our gov't won't do. But all those feelings and intents do not have bearing on what will happen down there.

I am trying to insert caution and reality, nothing more.